Pratap vs Shakti -- Confrontation of Dedication and Greed - Page 6

Originally posted by: Skepblun

Shakti is easier to relate to, than Pratap. And Shakti is not entirely a dark character.

I do not even see his behaviour as greed.

Yes at this juncture i can understand the pain he is going through,  but there is desire within him for the throne, indeed he feels rejected the way pratap is given so much of lime light but had love been only need then why he needs to put demand of choosing heir by a competition

He just wants what he feels he and his mother have been denied. He wants to prove himself. He wants his qualities to be noticed too.

i know he has seen the way he is sidelined but is it justified to lay with sentiments of nation for the next king they want??? there can be other ways to get back the respect but he choose "ratap vs him" strategies only

Frankly at times Rana ji has been lenient on Pratap or excused his mistakes. If the same things were done by anyone else he wouldn't be spared.

i agree on it, may be it is because pratap is his favorite but the way rana ji got angry on pratap yesterday for interfaring in his decision proves that he can not tolerate even pratap questioning his decision, then how can he tolerate shakti questioning his decision of making pratap the heir??

Shakti is defiant and increasingly so because he gets bad treatment from his father and he has seen even his mother being publicly humiliated and shit scared by his father.

If Pratap was not coming to the competition then what was the need to shout at Sajja bai and say words like, "Hum uss Shakti ko uttaradhikari bana dein?" That too in front of everyone?😕

i agree uday singh is too rude to sajja bai and jaivanta bai, but unlike others jaivanta bai never told pratap how uday singh insulted her before everyone asking her to leave, jaivanta bai never told pratap that bhatiyani dissolved poison in his drink, jaivanta bai never told pratap dat is was conspiracy of bhatiyani to make pratap physically hurt so as he didnt win that competition, jaivanta bai is a perfect mother who has made pratap the way he is, had sajja bai given such upbringing to shakti, he would have been better.

Udai Singh and praja wants Pratap, fine. But do not undermine Shakti or brush aside his capabilities so openly!😲

He got best score in gurukul entrance test and even later. That does show he has ability!

but he got defeated from injured pratap in the competition, then how can he be said more able than pratap? even though competition was made more tough

Pratap was more into taking things in his own hands and venturing out without permission (like they checked out that secret tunnel in palace). Whereas Shakti was initially not at all into breaking rules or taking things in his own hands. He was obedient despite his frustrations.

i agree on it!!! 

Shakti gets very little credit or praise for whatever positive things he does. Is it not frustrating to see that your father is curious at your success and more concerned about lack of success of his favoured son instead of joy and acceptance of your success?😕

yes but remember initial days of gurukul, wasnt pratap treated equally demoralizing by guruji??? but did his respect flicked a bit for guruji???

Anyone would be disturbed if he got the treatment that Shakti gets from Udai Singh & co. - either he would be depressed or he would be filled with rage and resentment.😲

Shakti uses more brain than Pratap. I had to commend him when he did not accept Bhaatiyani's sugar coated BS at once at face value, rather he questioned her why she was so concerned about him if she too had favoured and loved Pratap all along. He did stump her for once!👍🏼

i liked shakti there!! i think pratap needs to understand people much more, he is totally raw in this

It is good to be kind hearted but it doesn't mean you do not use tact!

Pratap lacks tact. Forget being suspicious, he is not even curious if the matter is related to someone he is attached to - a friend, a teacher or a relative! This is dangerous for a king and an administrator. In fact dangerous for anyone.

yes i agree on this too, as i said pratap needs to learn a lot.

but hadnt uday singh mistaken too, forgiving shams khan then when he came with changed face, he was forgiven due to jagmal's birth, but yeah pratap should learn to tackle people and read their intentions, like in bashar han track too, he was believing him unnecessarily 

Jaywanta bai is good, kind and generous but she does have sense to see what is real and what is fake. Pratap lacks that. Even if he gets curious, like he got curious about Basar Khan once, he drops that instead of discussing it with others or trying to resolve the doubts he has in his mind.

yes i mentioned same above!! 

A king must be prepared to deal with anything. But Pratap is not! He was hiding his face when that traitor was beheaded (Rana ji had to force him to see it). He loses concentration when he thinks of friends or family or even a danger to guru. 

yes pratap is weak emotionally, i wish he gets over it soon

That is not a good sign.

In a battle a lapse of a split second is enough to change political scenario!😲

Guru is harsh on Pratap. He should tone it down and he did show positive role in motivating him in ME. But he definitely needs to work on Pratap's over-sensitivity and getting blinded/distracted or readily believing people he loves/respects. 

Guru praises Shakti because he earned that praise. At times Guru has also taunted him for blurting out learnt by rote speeches to him. Partly, guru also praises him to check Pratap and keep him on his toes and not take his abilities or path of success for granted. Guru knows that Udai Singh and praja values Pratap a lot already, so he is only trying to ensure that Pratap does not get either complacent, overconfident or assured of his success and abilities. 

Shakti, recognition of his abilities and his open praise are Guru's way of doing a balancing act. 

I think he also wants to test reactions of everybody. How Shakti behaves when praised and how Pratap behaves when praised or not. 

Making things more difficult for Pratap are his way of pushing him to limits and preparing him for the worst (anything that is). If Pratap fails or retaliates, then it will be clear what the limit of his ability is. But if he keeps on following orders without a word and rather comes out with flying colours then it will be clear how exceptional he is.

guru track was good i wished to watch more of it, but sadly they ended it so soon, i think still pratap needs to learn a lot but dont know how much he will get to know without guruji

Also, Shakti has broken less rules than Pratap (like entering late or getting admitted despite failing entrance test). So probably he gets bit of favour (apparently).

Shakti has faced difficulties and discrimination at home itself this is why his goal is restricted to defeating Pratap. While Pratap has got everything and all the favours so he can think about serving the people (who favour him anyway, especially after that battle - that too, which was more to Rajrana's credit or else Pratap would have faltered! Rajrana created the conditions for Pratap to function properly).

I do not favour Shakti. But I do understand him and empathise with him. 😊He at least wants to prove himself to Udai Singh and co. I'd have left such parent and even convinced my mom to leave home together if we got the treatment that Shakti and Sajja get! [SERIOUSLY!]

i understand this point

Udai Singh's excessive and blind favour to Bhaatiyani puts even adult and mature women like Jaywanta and Sajja ill at ease at times. Shakti and other brothers are still kids! Won't they be affected?

Udai Singh is just not willing to give Shakti a chance - forget heir, he does not even want to recognise his abilities as a student! 

Shakti may not become a good king because his own feelings drive him more than people's concerns. As for fighting with professional assassins or fighting a battle, I do not think we can make conclusions about it because Shakti has not been put in such situations yet so to judge him how he deals with such situations.

It is commendable that Pratap fought valiantly in the battle and with Bashar Khan. But let us not forget that he was not alone. He had army and Rajrana with him in battle and he had plan laid out by guru, fellow disciples and father Udai Singh and his men later. On his own, he used tact around Shams Khan's camp earlier when they went to steal mangoes. But there also, it was luck that he and Shakti threw mangoes on Shams Khan's men and managed to run away. (That was the most foolish scene in the entire show! Such trained Afghan soldiers got attacked and debilitated by throwing mere mangoes at them? 😆)

Pratap is first to rise to a challenge. But alone - he either escaped by chance or got injured. He has had crucial help from people like Guru and Rajrana ji in grave dangers he faced. And if it is something that involves a friend or family then he is not even able to recognise that there's a challenge for him!😕

Both Pratap and Shakti are determined in their own way. (Though Shakti's determination is fired more by bitterness at Udai Singh and resulting envy and anger at Pratap)

But it depends on portrayal. Pratap is doing exceptional despite injuries in the competition. While Shakti is normal and healthy. I don't know if Shakti would have participated had he been as badly injured as Pratap was. So I cannot comment on his ability or inability.

Ideally I would like Pratap to WIN this competition so that it is proven that he can overcome all odds. 👍🏼I also want egg on that Bhaatiyani's 🤬 face who has been smiling too much at Pratap's misses!😡 This will also show how motivation from one's guru goes a long way in helping someone function according to their potential.😊

But frankly speaking I loved Shakti's OPEN defiance of that Udai Singh!😈 So I would not mind if he won!😉😆

Pratap would be a tad relieved of conspiracies if he weren't Yuvraj and backlash of praja would make Udai Singh also self-introspect if he should allow his decisions to be influenced by that Bhaatiyani or not. If she barks in case of Shakti also, then I hope he gets suspicious of her. Wishful thinking!🥱

But I feel the competition may not proceed to completion. I suspect Shams Khan will create trouble as Som discovers his plans or gets suspicious of him. There might be a blast, tragedy or commotion due to which competition gets cancelled midway.

your predictions were right, flag wasnt taken because of blast and though it got complete still it was incomplete

Let's see.

Originally posted by: cherryberry293

Liked all the discussion going on here. 😊
The way Shakti behaves for that Uday Singh's favorism is responsible.
Uday Singh cud b a gr8 king but Je fails to prove himself as good husband & father..
US favors Pratap and neglects Shakti when it comes to his sons andhe favors Bhatiyani when it comes to his wives. 🤢

So for me Uday Singh is d reason y Shakti hates his elder brother.

And they r showing Teenage Pratap, so v can't expect him to b all good and sensible at tender age.
We will see this matured Pratap after a leap who will b d warrior of our history ⭐️

Till then we'll have to enjoy this track which em doing currently 😃

Originally posted by: lovely_lady

It's not necessarily about receiving equality in money or anything. It's about receiving equality the way they are treated by THEIR FATHER. Udai Singh favours Pratap, you'd be blind not to see that. Shakti is completely side-lined by everyone. And this is even more strikingly when you realized that technically, according to the oldest=heir rule that Udai uses to justify making Pratap heir, Shakti would be 3rd in line. With the way they were always under attack, it makes perfect sense to plan ahead in case something happens to Pratap. But no one even thinks about this. If anything had ever happened to Pratap, then the throne would've gone to Shakti, whose been ignored up until then. That's just such bad planning on their part. 

And as for their intrinsic nature, there's pros and cons to both Shakti and Pratap. Shakti opposing gurukul, can be thought of as arrogant, but it can also be thought of him standing up for himself and others; he think's the guru ji's ways are harsh and unnecessary and doesn't feel like he's learning anything. In that sense, he's actually standing up for the right of getting a better education no? Pratap never doubting Bhatiyani, can be thought of as being a part of his "sweet" nature, but can also be a naivety, which prevents him from seeing when people are playing games with him = very, very bad quality for a King.  

Also, my observations are based from what the show is showing. At this point, both Shakti and Pratap are KIDS. I don't know what went down to making Shakti turn his back on his "motherland." All I'm saying, is that everything isn't as two dimensional as you might think. There's a lot of shades to the character's in the show, and I'm just trying to show you some of Shakti's. He's not only black and white (good or bad) at all, he's grey (good AND bad) 😊

Originally posted by: cherryberry293

Shakti seems to b in good mood in this 😊

Originally posted by: Skepblun

From happenings in last episode and the new promo it is clear why Shakti turned against his nation.

All blame on that Udai Singh! 😡 Which king carries family feuds to full darbar?!

The way Udai Singh behaved in darbar it did not look like a face to face between a father and son, rather a clash of male egos where the older and the "man in charge" was putting down the small fish for challenging him and failing in the big game.

Udai Singh never behaved like a father to Shakti. So it is evident why Shakti also isn't behaving like a son should.

Shakti is a frustrated and now, a wounded soul as well.

Another mistake is that Sajjabai gets panicky instead of being stoic and guiding him the way Jaywanta guides Pratap. She is like a child woman and not self assured herself. She is scared of Rana ji. Scared of her child's temperamental nature also. So she either remains silent, or cries, or pampers Shakti or scolds him at times. She's a nice woman, but doesn't know how to deal with challenges of mothering a growing boy.

Shakti is less greedy. He is more of a son who is frustrated by neglect of his father.

He has equal amount of fire and inferiority complex in him. All his anger is only a cloak for his complex bred by neglect of his father towards him - and his mother (everyone and their dog get more attention from Rana ji than poor Sajjabai!).

I think his concentration gets lost due to comparisons with Pratap. His father and others in royals kept doing it all the time so much so that now even his thinking has been restricted to comparisons with Pratap only.

The way even guards/servants were sniggering at him and taking digs at him, just showed what a pathetic position he was in! No one deserves to be treated like that!

Seeds of hate have been sown now. Useless guards will snigger only if King is also thoughtless enough to carry family feud to the darbar! 🤢

Thank you for replying to that lengthy post Pari! 😊

My answers on some of your points:

- Shakti is not greedy per se for throne. He wants throne because of the status that would come with it and the respect it would get to him and his mother. Also I won't blame Shakti for this throne thing because Udai Singh also focuses on sons more as candidates for heirs and not as his sons alone. So if everyone is talking about Raj gaddi only then it is easy for a kid of growing age to get swept in that tide. Bhaatiyani too filled his ears.
And since he is already a neglected kid so such thoughts got to him easily, compared to Pratap. Pratap basically has everything. So he need not think of the throne.

- Pratap has been held as gold standard by all. It is others who do comparison all the time. Shakti gets compared to him even when he succeeds. So no wonder his thinking has become limited to Pratap vs himself and he had no focus on his own identity as a whole. Talking of betraying the nation, then recent episodes where even lowly servants and guards have insulted him, it is evident why he did not feel patriotic for those people and that land. It became a way of getting back at them for what they did to him!

But let's also not forget that Pratap's goodness and his own blood did play a role somewhere and his heart did have a place for them this is why he even helped Pratap in the battle, risking punishment for himself in Mughal court! That means his heart was not all poison and bitterness.

- Rana ji did bark at Pratap but only once. Whereas Shakti has been barked at or ignored many times. And favouritism is not going well even with wives so how can kids handle it? Very few kids can handle parents' partiality!
Shakti questioned Udai Singh partly due to his own defiance and partly due to Bhaatiyani instigating him. He was doing better than Pratap in gurukul so he felt he deserved a chance too. This feeling was fuelled more by Bhaatiyani also. So he questioned Udai Singh's blind favouritism.

By that time, Pratap had not yet obtained full marks or come on top in gurukul tests.

- I agree with your comments on Jaywanta bai. But how can we assume that Sajja bai cries to Shakti about her woes? We have never seen Sajja crib in front of Shakti. Rather Shakti has witnessed himself how his mother is ignored or scolded (when he was peeping in secretly in the chamber as Rana ji and Sajja bai had convo). Maybe that is why he feels himself that his mother is neglected or treated like trash.
Sajja bai does not cry injustice. But yes she fails to teach lessons to Shakti the way Jaywanta teaches Pratap. Sajja has only scolded Shakti but has never worked extra hard to remove bitterness from his heart. Like I said, she is scared of Rana ji and scared of Shakti's temperamental nature too. She is not sure of dealing with Shakti. She doesn't want him to feel bad. But doesn't know how to tackle him without making him feel that even his mother does not support or love him.

- When I wrote that post, Pratap was behind Shakti in gurukul. But still I had written that I don't know if Shakti would have even participated had he been as badly injured as Pratap! I only said Shakti is not entirely useless. The fact that he got best score in gurukul entrance test only showed he had something in him. He's not a nobody as Udai Singh treats him. Though I do feel he can't handle the pressure that Pratap has shown he can handle!

- Yes Pratap was treated badly by Guruji initially. But he had broken rules too. And it was evident he would get that scolding. Plus Guru was rude to almost all students initially. It wasn't like he was polite and loving to one and breathing fire at others. So we can't compare him to Rana ji who clearly behaves differently with all and seems to have a different set of rules in dealing with all! Also, parents matter more than guru because they are always with you. One can once handle rejection by an outsider. But rejection or neglect by parent hurts more.

Still I agree that it is to Pratap's credit that his respect never went down for the guru despite whatever he did to him in front of the entire gurukul. I have never denied Pratap's good qualities.

But I would like to know how Pratap would have behaved if he was in Shakti's place as a son and a prince. Though I think Jaywanta bai's self assured and sane upbringing and constant check on his behaviour would have made him better equipped to deal with unfairness from all quarters. 😊

- Glad you agree that Pratap is emotionally weak in the sense that he trusts easily, does not get much suspicious and gets sensitive not to hurt anyone physically! I am happy he killed Shams Khan and got stronger. But he was hesitating to stab him too initially.

Pratap must be fired up when dealing with the opponent as he was that day when he was filled with rage at Som's death.

I hope in his next battle he does not hesitate to hurt anyone and doesn't turn his sight away from blood.

Udai Singh is useless and I feel Pratap's weakness is due to Udai Singh effect! He is no model to understand anything or explain any point!
🤢

If Udai Singh blindly believes Bhaatiyani or forgave Shams Khan and other criminals just in happiness at Jagmal's birth then he and whole Mewar had to pay for these blunders only! 😡 Usne konsa koi acha kaam kiya?

Shakti is emotionally frazzled due to father's neglect and can be easily moulded when reminded that he got unfair treatment. But he has tact not to trust others easily. And he doesn't get scared of violence. (which is evident in his attack at jail guards 😆 ). He is so bitter now that he can hurt anyone - be it himself or others.