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Dont understand shivani's volte face (Page 3)

monamie111 IF-Rockerz
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Posted: 21 December 2011 at 11:39pm | IP Logged
Forgive me, I must not have made myself clear.
 
 
The point I am trying to make is that shivani feels gauri is wrong only after having met anandi -- and seeing that anandi is a sarpanch and has khule vichaar etc.
 
Though she knew all the facts (including gauri's illegal status of wife) -- she considered it okay then because she assumed that anandi was indeed gawar and anpadh and that jagat had moved away from anandi because of his mindset not matching.  
 
i don't think shivani has thought that anandi is ganwaar..she may have thought that jagat was not happy with his wife!..it was a force marriage..and jagat loves gauri only!..they r happy with each other..
 
Now she is impressed with anandi and as per the pre-cap says "anandi ne 16 years bittaye hain jagat ke saath -- in comparison to your five years".
 
My point is that she already knew enough to do the math (of a child bride having spent several years with Jagat before ditching her for gauri) -- so now what is her problem?
Shivani should have had an issue with it the first time gauri told her the whole story itself.  Instead, she encouraged gauri to continue this illegitimate pregnancy ...
 
shivani have problem with gauri's thought and her mean thinking towards anandi!..gauri always blames anandi!..she told so many worng things about anandi..shivani has problem with that only!..as simple as that!..
 
My point is that her stand should have been issue focused and not personality focused.
 
i am seriously not understanding tinoo..i think u have problem with J-G marriage only! is it?..r u trying to tell that the marriage itself should not happen?..why shivani ji will oppose theri marriage and tell gauri to abort her child when she knows that they r happy with each other, they wants to stay with each other?..the problem is not the second marriage but how they did the marriage!!..they didn't bothered about J's family and anandi..how they hurt them..i thought this is the issue!..not the marriage!..Confused..shivani came to know all these things after she met j's family..she has just understood now that A in not a bad gurl..and i think she is trying to tell G the same thing..Confused...
 
How does it make a difference if anandi is a sarpanch, educated or khule vichaar waali?
 
it only made shivani understand that what gauri told her was worng..thats it?..so she came to talk to g..whats wrong in it?..can't she told her fren that see..i have found that what u have told me was not right..i think u have misunderstood anandi?..Shocked..she is doing what a true fren should do!..Confused
 
Even if anandi was gawar, anpadh, had ordinary parents like phooli's maa baapu, or gauris maa baapu -- what jagat did was still wrong.   Would shivani continue being okay with gauri's illegitimacy if anandi was indeed gawar and anpadh?
 
i think have totally misunderstood the thing..did shivani suported bharat's family?..she knows it that it was the mistake of phooli's father..still she supported phooli only!..Confused..i m not understanding why u r comapring phol's situation with A and J-G..both r totally diff..
 
 
And shivani is seeing anandi just now -- when all these changes have taken place recently.
 
What if she met anandi a year ago - when anandi did not have a sarpanch title, when anandi did not have a backbone or confident body language?,  when anandi did not have the support of dadisa for her adult education class or her other activities.
 
That would then have been a completely different anandi.
 
So, in shivani's mind, would jagat's leaving gauri have been justified then?
 
i think it is not related to the sarpanch title!..i m sure even if anandi would not be the sarpanh shivani ji is intelligent enough to understand anandi is not an evil gurl!..i m watching BV since 3 yrs..did i not understand it that anandi is much better than gauri?..Tongue..i think before anandi became the sarpanch i knew it..so why would not shivani ji understand this?..Shocked
 
Atleast Kundatai is issue focused -- she has never met anandi, but she didnt care.
she took a stand based on the issue.
 
i m very happy that kunda tai kicked them out from the house..bcoz i want them to suffer!Tongue..but  is it right to take a step without knowing the full truth???..kunda tai is mad with the fact that its their 2nd marriage..how would shivani react like kunda tai with the gurl who saved her life?..Shocked and for what..just bcoz its their 2nd marriage?..Confused and not the legal one too?..then what about what G told her..how J left his family for her and all those sacrifices for love?..TongueLOL..why shivani ji would not trust the gurl who just saved her life?..Confused if the gurl is saying that they r happy then they must be happy..how is it possible for shivani to understand the other side's story?..Confused
 
I once again re-iterate the case of phooli.
 
If I were friends with bharat -- and he told me this whole surrogacy thing -- I would have slapped him on the face without needing to meet phooli -- the whole scenario itself would have been completely revolting to me.
 
It is not that i would continue to be friends with bharat -- and only after meeting phooli and seeing what a sweet person she is would i take Bharat to task.
 
 


Edited by monamie111 - 22 December 2011 at 1:10am

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Posted: 21 December 2011 at 11:50pm | IP Logged
I always wondered why Shivaniji never felt that Anandi had been wronged when she heard gauri's story in the first place.
She did not tell gauri to gt divorce fist even after that illegal issue thing she and gauri discussed.

But what I can say is that she thought,

A. Jageya's first wife to be like all the villagers. Thoe who believe in old customs which has no value and are cruel too.

B. jagya's first wife to be an uneducated gawar. 

SO she assumed that it's good that's he got away from such mentality people and left that girl , whom he never loved and married gauri. Th girl who is compatible to him and whom he loves.

From gauri's constant talk about anandi , to be this blood sucking, husband stealing woman, she got the impression of an ex who is really not worth it.


Buttt...
When she met anandi she came to know how strong she is.
First she found out that not all villagers are the same. 
She agreed that she had wrong impression about villagers and people living in such place. 

Then acknowledged the good anandi was doings for phooli. With out knowinge the truth about her. She concluded that anandi is a really good girl.

So now she knows two people gauri and anandi.

In her mind Gauri is the one who saved her life. Good doctor but has some personal issues with he husband's ex. 


Anandi is the daughter of this wonderful parents who really helped her out to become the gem she is 
.

Then...

She came to know off anandi's plight. She got really sad that how can someone leave such a good girl.

...

And harshly she came to know of the missing link, jagya.

So now she has two worlds, two friends crashing with each other.

Before she formed an opinion she talked with aNandi and found that anandi has truly moved on.

Then what did she conclude?
That the picture gauri painted in her mind about jagya's ex, which eas probably grey in color , that picture was painted with this wonderful girl anandi.

She said herself that she has learnt a lesson that even education not necessarily opens ones mind. 


So if you were trying to say that now Shivaniji is taking anandi side, then that is wrong. No rather she has seen from her own eyes the other sidet of the coin. And now she judges that , it's the insecurities of gauri that's really the main cause of her marital problems. And this is the truth.


Honestly... If and Only if. Gauri would just leave anandi out of her life. Ad not bring her every turn then her life would be calmer. If only she. Trusted jagya no surprisingly has not ran back to anandi yet and is trying to work on his relationship with gauri.



So right now I say Shivaji is just trying to tell gauri what the real problem is, and that is, her own insecurity. And her guilt. 

If only she would have stopped and thought about jagya's family too before takings such drastic step then things would have Been different. 


Edited by Suchi-NivReniac - 21 December 2011 at 11:54pm

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Posted: 22 December 2011 at 1:39am | IP Logged
Originally posted by Suchi-NivReniac

I always wondered why Shivaniji never felt that Anandi had been wronged when she heard gauri's story in the first place.
She did not tell gauri to gt divorce fist even after that illegal issue thing she and gauri discussed.

But what I can say is that she thought,

A. Jageya's first wife to be like all the villagers. Thoe who believe in old customs which has no value and are cruel too.

B. jagya's first wife to be an uneducated gawar. 

SO she assumed that it's good that's he got away from such mentality people and left that girl , whom he never loved and married gauri. Th girl who is compatible to him and whom he loves.

yaa, it is exactly this that i have a problem with -- that she initially  thought it was okay because of A and B. you mention.
 
My point is that even if A and B had been true -- that was still no reason for shivaniji to encourage gauri on the grounds of principle, to go ahead with the illegal marriage and the illegitimate pregnancy.
 
Let us assume anandi was an old-fashioned girl, with no education, who is in a ghunghat and who does nothing else except tel maalish of her elders and makes adrak chai -- did that still justify the fact that jagat left his first legal wife -- and had this illegal relationship with gauri?
 
I think that shivani felt it was okay.
 
It is a different thing that anandi is so much more -- but even if she had not been that at all-- shivani should still have put a stop to this nonsense when they first had their conversation on the bridge.
 
The point is not anandi's character -- the point is the precap -- where she says "anandi spent 16 years with him" -- so this time span was known on the conversation on the bridge with the ice candy.
 
 
That being said -- that entire conversation was shown as flashbacks.  It is hard to say what was said and what was understood about anandi per se. 
 
 
 
 
 
 

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Posted: 22 December 2011 at 1:44am | IP Logged
Originally posted by intruderfast

 
 brilliant points tinooClap, and finally a good topic worth commenting in this forumLOL
i mean when gauri confessed all to shivani that time she didnt even badmouth anandi also, she didnt speak abt her much
apart from that she told her everything , then gr8 shivani told that marriage is a piece of paper , u and jagat share a relation continue continueLOL
now she starts comparing anandi 16 yrs with gauri 5 yrs
actually she should question jagya here if she wants why gauri
shivani ne anandi se milke kaunse zhande gaad liye , i dont understand
the issue i think is not abt child marriage anymore its abt who spent more time with jagyaTongueLOLLOLand here the winner is anandi so jagya go back to anandi
 
 
Exactly intruderfast! thank you
 
This line in red is what i am referring to -- thanks. 
yes, she told gauri, marriage is just a piece of paper, it doesnt really mean anything.  what counts for each other is feelings.
 
 
so then, it was okay, that Jagat had no feelings for first wife. 
 
But now all of a sudden, Jagat has spent 16 years with her, feelings be damned -- it is the time span that counts.
 
 

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Posted: 22 December 2011 at 4:20am | IP Logged
I think we are putting too much faith Shivani's moral compass. Shivani is no nyay ki devi. The point is Shivani sees the J-A-G situation from a new light because her own perspective has changed. She did not have a problem with Gauri earlier, precisely because, as Suchi points out, she herself was prejudiced against villages and villagers. Let us not assume that Shivani was a righteous woman from the beginning. Instead, it makes sense to think that Shivani herself had a narrow point of view which was pretty biased. With that point of view, Gauri's actions seemed right to her. She really did not care what an uneducated, village girl went through, simply because she identified more with Gauri and thought more like Gauri.

Now, Shivani behaves differently precisely because her own prejudices and biases have been cured. I am not sure if Shivani had felt equally bad about Anandi if she were just a village simpleton with no striking personality traits. However, the fact is Anandi has indeed shaken Shivani's own prejudices and corrected her biased point of view. It is this enlightenment that Shivani wants to share with Gauri, who she thinks needs to open her eyes too.



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Posted: 22 December 2011 at 4:27am | IP Logged
Originally posted by woman11

I think we are putting too much faith Shivani's moral compass. Shivani is no nyay ki devi. The point is Shivani sees the J-A-G situation from a new light because her own perspective has changed. She did not have a problem with Gauri earlier, precisely because, as Suchi points out, she herself was prejudiced against villages and villagers. Let us not assume that Shivani was a righteous woman from the beginning. Instead, it makes sense to think that Shivani herself had a narrow point of view which was pretty biased. With that point of view, Gauri's actions seemed right to her. She really did not care what an uneducated, village girl went through, simply because she identified more with Gauri and thought more like Gauri.

Now, Shivani behaves differently precisely because her own prejudices and biases have been cured. I am not sure if Shivani had felt equally bad about Anandi if she were just a village simpleton with no striking personality traits. However, the fact is Anandi has indeed shaken Shivani's own prejudices and corrected her biased point of view. It is this enlightenment that Shivani wants to share with Gauri, who she thinks needs to open her eyes too.



 
ooh woman 11 -- excellent!  this clears it up for me.
you are so good at this with your laser beam thoughts. ClapClap
 
yes, shivani herself was prejudiced against villages and villagers.  I did make the (yes faulty) assumption that shivani was a righteous woman from the beginning with a strong sense of ethics and morals.
 
 

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Posted: 22 December 2011 at 7:47am | IP Logged
:) thanks Anatara.

Remember when she said to gauri to keep on the child as he will get his legal share .. I was like What the !!!

I think we all objected and were mocking her mentor-ness 

The only reason now why shivani supports Anandi is cause she saw the other side of the coin, and as you rightly said, a STRIKING side. 

Anandi is a girl that makes a mark ! and that she did.

I can even go on to say that Shivani might have been like Gauri at her younger age .. but the difference between shivani and gauri now is that, she has agreed to her faults of making presumptions about villagers and thinking or not think about their plight.

And she changed her perspectives on life and things as she herself said that she has learnt the big lesson after coming to the village.

===

This is exactly what Gauri and Jagya needs to learn. 

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Posted: 22 December 2011 at 10:25am | IP Logged
Originally posted by woman11

I think we are putting too much faith Shivani's moral compass. Shivani is no nyay ki devi. The point is Shivani sees the J-A-G situation from a new light because her own perspective has changed. She did not have a problem with Gauri earlier, precisely because, as Suchi points out, she herself was prejudiced against villages and villagers. Let us not assume that Shivani was a righteous woman from the beginning. Instead, it makes sense to think that Shivani herself had a narrow point of view which was pretty biased. With that point of view, Gauri's actions seemed right to her. She really did not care what an uneducated, village girl went through, simply because she identified more with Gauri and thought more like Gauri.

Now, Shivani behaves differently precisely because her own prejudices and biases have been cured. I am not sure if Shivani had felt equally bad about Anandi if she were just a village simpleton with no striking personality traits. However, the fact is Anandi has indeed shaken Shivani's own prejudices and corrected her biased point of view. It is this enlightenment that Shivani wants to share with Gauri, who she thinks needs to open her eyes too.



well said antara!!!ClapClapClapi was also thinking like this but i want 2 add one more thing that she'd never seen the true victim of 2nd marriages like JG marriage causes as shes a city bred rather metropolitan city bred prsn whos dealing wid  high class mostly where she'd seen such cases widout any victimization like celeberties & high class ppl do 2nd marriages leaving 1st ones or hav extramarital affairs & in most of the cases either of the spouses hav rarely feelings abt it bcoz of their thinking. but once she went 2 village & saw A as strong & nice, which was total opposite of wat G'd told her, but felt her sadness,emptiness & deep hurt she has changed her perspective 2wards such things of life!!
earlier she was like G who always thot that its their life,their rt 2 choice at marriagable age whether it affects sum1else or not it doesn't concern & bcoz of their rt 2 choice if sum1 gets hurt then its not her fault or shes not responsible as she shud think of only her happiness even if its on the grave of happiness of genuine & nice human being( i m saying it genuine bcoz sum ppl don't deserve gud things so if they get hurt i won't mind esply who r selfish 2 the core of hurting genuinely innocent prsn) but after meeting A & singh family she saw the bad consequences of not just bal-viavh but also of infidelity & cheating!!so she changed her thot process & even accepted her fault!! so here atleast shivani is better till now as she accepted her faults & biased approach 2wards village ppl & so many oder aspects of life!!

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