The case: Phooli Vs Gauri - Page 7

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Missesha

@Missesha

IF-Dazzler

+ 2

Posted: 12 years ago

Originally posted by: gangubai1
AS I've already posted in this thread. Phooli is not Bharat's legal wife. Nor can she claim maintenance or alimony as a wife. She has been brought to the family as a concubine (a mistress, kept for the sake of bearing children). The maximum support she can expect is that given to a surrogate mother.

Hiring a surrogate mother when the legal wife is unable to bear children is legal under the Indian laws. Under this law the birth certificate of the child will have the name of the genetic father and his legal wife. The surrogate mother is not given any recognition. This is the same law which allowed actor Aamir Khan to father a child recently, when his current wife Kiran was unable to conceive.

Phooli did not have a marriage with Bharat, she accepted him as her protector under Naata Pratha. Under Naata Pratha the woman accepts a man as her protector and lives with him as his keep. This is a way for men to declare ownership over women (esp. widows and young orphan girls) who do not have family support. Most women give in to this kind of harassment in order to escape a worse fate as a target for the entire village.

Thanks for sharing :)

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Missesha

@Missesha

IF-Dazzler

+ 2

Posted: 12 years ago

So does that mean that Gauri & Phooli are of equal status? if J dumps G one fine day and declares her as his 'naata' - (because his legal doc has no value) then Is G the same as P today?

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sreevask

@sreevask

Goldie

Posted: 12 years ago

Originally posted by: Missesha
At Sreevask, thanks for sharing the info.. it atleast gives hope that Phooli will win and get her baby back. But does any one know exactly what Naata Pratha is and what rights does a lady have on her kids?

And if a guy is in a marital relationship legally, can he bring another woman home, that too with society's approval?

Phooli can file a case of fraud against the family and as a mother she can get rights over her baby, so hope she wins... I can't see her losing... but I do feel that Phooli made a big mistake by accepting Naata... I wish an educated girl like her never did that.

u r welcome missesha...

1) As a biological mother she WILL always have rights over her baby...for which alimony MUST be arranged by the baby's biological father & the baby gets all the properties (un-willed) of his biological parents.Then also if the baby wishes to stay with his mother (Phooli) only,then also his dirty dad can't do any thing...

2)Law never encourages polygamy for any reason...but the family can appoint a surrogate mother to carry out their lineage/heredity/warrisy...(which is also regulated by ART Bill,,vide http://www.bioedge.org/index.php/bioethics/bioethics_article/9781)

3)I liked the high lighted remark.Being an educated,she should have shown prudence but it is the sentimental threat that ditched her in to the social evil.If Gauri is in her place, she'd have thrown her father in to the well before he threatens her.

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Purva

@-Purva-

IF-Dazzler

+ 5

Posted: 12 years ago

No Gauri and Phooli do not have equal status. Jagya and Gauri went to a court and tried to have a registered marriage. Also they underwent the entire marriage rituals in a temple in the presence of witnesses (Gauri's parent, the pundit etc.) So Jagya has to give Gauri the status of a wife. That it is an illegal marriage and that Gauri knew beforehand that he was married has no bearing on the fact. Also Jagya and Gauri are living as husband and wife and have declared that to the college and their friends. Gauri therefore can claim that Jagya cheated her. She has the right to demand maintenance, sue Jagya for cheating and also her children are legal heirs to Singh family properties. Gauri herself is also recognised as the legal parent of her children.

In case of Phooli, she was brought under the Naata. That same fact was declared in front of the entire village. She was never given the social status of Bharat's wife. Even in the house, they always showed Phooli staying in a hut kind of room, never the main house. Also legally Phooli has no claim over the child. Bharat and his wife are given the recognition as the child's parents. Phooli can never claim that the child is hers. She can at best ask for compensation for bearing the child, but that is not fixed by the courts and Bharat's family can claim that their contract with Phooli involved only taking care of her living and medical expenses till such time as the child is born, nothing more. Legally also they are not required to do any more for Phooli.

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Purva

@-Purva-

IF-Dazzler

+ 5

Posted: 12 years ago

Sreevask

Under surrogacy laws the biological mother has no claims over the child. The birth certificate of the child will carry the name of Bharat's legal wife. The child belongs to Bharat and his wife. They are only obligated to take care of the surrogate mother for the duration of the childbirth. Any compensation over and above that is based on mutual understanding of the two parties. Since Phooli never questioned her in-laws and since her father did receive a hefty cash-filled suitcase from her mother-in-law prior tot he ceremony, there is nothing more that PHooli can claim.

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sreevask

@sreevask

Goldie

Posted: 12 years ago

Originally posted by: gangubai1
AS I've already posted in this thread. Phooli is not Bharat's legal wife. Nor can she claim maintenance or alimony as a wife. She has been brought to the family as a concubine (a mistress, kept for the sake of bearing children). The maximum support she can expect is that given to a surrogate mother.

Hiring a surrogate mother when the legal wife is unable to bear children is legal under the Indian laws. Under this law the birth certificate of the child will have the name of the genetic father and his legal wife. The surrogate mother is not given any recognition. This is the same law which allowed actor Aamir Khan to father a child recently, when his current wife Kiran was unable to conceive.

Phooli did not have a marriage with Bharat, she accepted him as her protector under Naata Pratha. Under Naata Pratha the woman accepts a man as her protector and lives with him as his keep. This is a way for men to declare ownership over women (esp. widows and young orphan girls) who do not have family support. Most women give in to this kind of harassment in order to escape a worse fate as a target for the entire village.

Phooli need not be legal wife to file a petition under domestic violence act, as quoted previously---

"The Act seeks to cover those women who are or have been in a relationship with the abuser where both parties have lived together in a shared household "

Edited by sreevask - 12 years ago

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Purva

@-Purva-

IF-Dazzler

+ 5

Posted: 12 years ago

So far from what they have shown the family has no inclination of throwing Phooli out, they only don't want her to be involved in childcare. Again not sure what Phooli's status would be in case of Domestic violence act because really the family is not throwing her out, depriving her of economic sustenance, nor are they getting physically or emotionally violent towards her. Where is the case? They didn't mislead her into thinking that she would be given the status of the wife, they didn't bring her into the family home. She walked into this with her eyes open and a blind faith.

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sreevask

@sreevask

Goldie

Posted: 12 years ago

Kindly vide the ART Bill for surrogate mothers...

[http://www.icmr.nic.in/guide/ART%20REGULATION%20Draft%20Bill1.pdf]

In that it is mentioned as POINT No.(8) (Pg No.26) A surrogate mother shall, in respect of all medical treatments or

procedures in relation to the concerned child, register at the hospital or

such medical facility in her own name, clearly declare herself to be a

surrogate mother, and provide the name or names and addresses of

the person or persons, as the case may be, for whom she is acting as

a surrogate, along with a copy of the certificate mentioned in clause 17

below.

Also,the concept of surrogacy does not apply to phooli as the following definition----

"surrogate mother", means a woman who is a citizen of India and is

resident in India, who agrees to have an embryo generated from the

sperm of a man who is not her husband and the oocyte of another

woman, implanted in her to carry the pregnancy to viability and deliver

the child to the couple / individual that had asked for surrogacy;"

There would be an agreement to this extent & has to be produced at the time of delivery & shall reflect in the birth certificate.

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Purva

@-Purva-

IF-Dazzler

+ 5

Posted: 12 years ago

Contesting a dispute in case of Nata pratha almost never happens, as it is widely prevalent in the area and has huge social sanction.

http://articles.timesofindia.indiatimes.com/2009-11-14/man-woman/28110804_1_nata-child-marriage-live-in-partners

Since all disputes in such cases are brought to the panchayat, this might be the first test of Anandi as a Sarpanch.

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hooked

@hooked

IF-Dazzler

Posted: 12 years ago

Originally posted by: gangubai1
Contesting a dispute in case of Nata pratha almost never happens, as it is widely prevalent in the area and has huge social sanction.

http://articles.timesofindia.indiatimes.com/2009-11-14/man-woman/28110804_1_nata-child-marriage-live-in-partners

Since all disputes in such cases are brought to the panchayat, this might be the first test of Anandi as a Sarpanch.

I just read it. This is so disturbing !!

According to the TOI article, Phooli seems unlikely to get the family punished for cheating her, but she may just be able to claim her baby back as mothers get preference and also a financial settlement.

But all the same it was a con and now it seems Phooli's parents are to blame coz they did not find out more about "Naata" b4 agreeing to it. Had they done a bit more research and asked around and taken the village elders advice - Phooli may not have been in this mess.

But in their favor, young widow's are often taken in by their deceased husband's younger brother and given financial protecttion n equal legal status and here P was cheated. The family lied about the first wife going permanently away.

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