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Preservation of culture (Page 3)

sareg IF-Dazzler
sareg
sareg

Joined: 10 January 2006
Posts: 3976

Posted: 15 January 2008 at 9:50am | IP Logged

Originally posted by qwertyesque

Originally posted by sareg

Lets take it this way

Walking on a street in Chennai, a couple from say UK is into high intensive PDA, what do people in Chennai say?

Now take a Indian man walking on the streets of Montreal, chewing on his Benaras pan and does his usual thing. Is it ok for the locals to come up to him and say this is not allowed here?

When you move to a foreign country you want to bring your personal heritage touch while adapting to the new culture. That is the beauty of North American culture.

Not come along with your whole shibang of native culture, you would stand out like a sore thumb, if you stand out like a sore thumb, people are going to take notice, some are going to take offense, some are going to ridicule(and then you are going to complain racism LOL ).

The bottom line(and not for lipservice only)

When in Rome, Do as Romans do without appearing like monkeys which most of them do when they try doing like americans do. Veri few really can do as the americans do elegantly without having to change themselves drastically... LOL

I am talking about adaptation you are talking about imitationWink

return_to_hades IF-Sizzlerz
return_to_hades
return_to_hades

Joined: 18 January 2006
Posts: 22674

Posted: 15 January 2008 at 10:31am | IP Logged
I agree with the age old adage too 'When in Rome, do as the Romans do'

To me the most imperative thing in visiting a country is understanding the local culture and assimilating yourself within it. If you feel that you are unable to understand and assimilate then you should reconsider going there.

I do not think assimilation is a compromise of personal morals or culture, but doing a balanced bit. I honestly do not think Canada is as extreme as making laws for people to dress skimpily.

Many westerners are fascinated with traditional outfits like sarees, salwar kameez and other unique and colorful clothing. They will willingly accept people wearing traditional clothing. However, westerners ultra conservative clothing like veils, feels restrictive and anti-social and feel unnerved when people insist on doing so.

What irks many westerners is the fact that they will wear veils and headdresses when in a conservative country but these very people refuse to change a bit when they come in their country. Another annoying factor is the double standards. Pseudo conservative people coming rambling about the greatness of their culture yet ogling at western women and behaving in a lewd manner.

What also angers many westerners is that even if people want to preserve their culture why do they have to criticize western culture. So many people adapt a holier than thou attitude and look upon western people in a demeaning manner. Won't we be pissed if someone came to our country and looked down on our ways.

Personally, I do not expect any radical changes. I believe Canada and United States are free countries and people should wear what they want. If a Middle Eastern woman wears the burkha that is her choice. I do not care. What needs to stop is cultural segregation. There is a whole wave of separate but equal sweeping through North America. Every immigrant community Indians, Asians, Middle Eastern, African, Latins, Slavs are all forming sub communities. They study and work together, but refuse to mingle with each other. Each is afraid of losing culture and refuses to socialize or assimilate with the rest of them. Children are encouraged to find friends within the same community, outsider friends are discouraged.

This needs to stop. We need to be social and share culture. There is good and bad in all cultural and cultural interaction is beneficial for society. People need to realize that culture will not get destroyed but will evolve for the next generation.
qwertyesque IF-Rockerz
qwertyesque
qwertyesque

Joined: 03 December 2006
Posts: 6124

Posted: 15 January 2008 at 11:16am | IP Logged
Originally posted by sareg

Originally posted by qwertyesque

Originally posted by sareg

Lets take it this way

Walking on a street in Chennai, a couple from say UK is into high intensive PDA, what do people in Chennai say?

Now take a Indian man walking on the streets of Montreal, chewing on his Benaras pan and does his usual thing. Is it ok for the locals to come up to him and say this is not allowed here?

When you move to a foreign country you want to bring your personal heritage touch while adapting to the new culture. That is the beauty of North American culture.

Not come along with your whole shibang of native culture, you would stand out like a sore thumb, if you stand out like a sore thumb, people are going to take notice, some are going to take offense, some are going to ridicule(and then you are going to complain racism LOL ).

The bottom line(and not for lipservice only)

When in Rome, Do as Romans do without appearing like monkeys which most of them do when they try doing like americans do. Veri few really can do as the americans do elegantly without having to change themselves drastically... LOL

I am talking about adaptation you are talking about imitationWink

you cant adapt without imitating... Dhona chod key pochna shuru karna may be adaptation or imitation.. the question is how much you are into using that paper at home...Smile.. Imitation is with appearance and behavior and I am not talking about that.....unless you give me some good examples of adaptation

Guardian Angel IF-Sizzlerz
Guardian Angel
Guardian Angel

Retro Podcast Team
Joined: 13 April 2006
Posts: 17062

Posted: 15 January 2008 at 5:11pm | IP Logged
Originally posted by Morning_Dew

A couple of days back I met one russian lady who , half her life worked in one of the middle east country and now recently move to Canada.

Her argument was , why muslims/ Sikhs living here don't leave their way of living behind. To her , when she was in middle east she was forced to cover herself (she was refering for not letting her wear mini skirts and half sleeves, face and head was already an execption) so she said , Canadian should impose such situation to those people too , to force them adopt Canadian  culture  and if they are not satisfied they can always go back to their countries.

What is your take on this?

 

  

Very good point Morning DewClap   But what culture and tradition are we talking about in Canada?  Its a multi-cultural society really where people from all countries come and live together.  From my experience I see people follow some traditiona of their own and then also live the Canadian lifestyle.  We have Folklorama Festival each year where people from different countries put up their displays, music, food and various t hings from their culture. 

Canada is certainly not telling people to leave their tradition but people are given education about their rights, about the social services, etc.  esp. when it involves sickening rights on young girls. 

I think the solution is not to enforce regime on citizens.  Thank you!!Tongue

qwertyesque IF-Rockerz
qwertyesque
qwertyesque

Joined: 03 December 2006
Posts: 6124

Posted: 15 January 2008 at 8:39pm | IP Logged
Originally posted by return_to_hades

I agree with the age old adage too 'When in Rome, do as the Romans do'

To me the most imperative thing in visiting a country is understanding the local culture and assimilating yourself within it. If you feel that you are unable to understand and assimilate then you should reconsider going there. Not necessarily.. Most asians are not even part of the Western main stream.. so living in that wierd delusion is better left alone..

I do not think assimilation is a compromise of personal morals or culture, but doing a balanced bit. I honestly do not think Canada is as extreme as making laws for people to dress skimpily.

Many westerners are fascinated with traditional outfits like sarees, salwar kameez and other unique and colorful clothing. They will willingly accept people wearing traditional clothing. However, westerners ultra conservative clothing like veils, feels restrictive and anti-social and feel unnerved when people insist on doing so. Ok they need to be trained to understand that a sikh in turban is no obama in disguise so if they use brains for a change instead of machines they would better understand that.. Peoples customs are not subject to local ignorance....

What irks many westerners is the fact that they will wear veils and headdresses when in a conservative country but these very people refuse to change a bit when they come in their country. Another annoying factor is the double standards. Pseudo conservative people coming rambling about the greatness of their culture yet ogling at western women and behaving in a lewd manner. Sure all these veiled people come with a brown color does that irk them too since you have taken up the role of western spokeswoman....LOL thank god they dont bleach them in their ire...

What also angers many westerners is that even if people want to preserve their culture why do they have to criticize western culture. I think this is more for seudo westerners. Americans dont really pwide that culture as much... but seudo's including abcd's sing a lot of praises fir a nonexistent culture So many people adapt a holier than thou attitude and look upon western people in a demeaning manner. Nobody looks down upon anyone but just pity the impoverished state of the same....Won't we be pissed if someone came to our country and looked down on our ways.Sure we do when people talk about indians eating monkey brains and land of snakes and elephants... sure we get irked too... 

Personally, I do not expect any radical changes. I believe Canada and United States are free countries and people should wear what they want. If a Middle Eastern woman wears the burkha that is her choice. I do not care. What needs to stop is cultural segregation. There is a whole wave of separate but equal sweeping through North America. Every immigrant community Indians, Asians, Middle Eastern, African, Latins, Slavs are all forming sub communities. They study and work together, but refuse to mingle with each other. Each is afraid of losing culture and refuses to socialize or assimilate with the rest of them. Children are encouraged to find friends within the same community, outsider friends are discouraged.

This needs to stop. We need to be social and share culture. There is good and bad in all cultural and cultural interaction is beneficial for society. People need to realize that culture will not get destroyed but will evolve for the next generation.
lighthouse IF-Dazzler
lighthouse
lighthouse

Joined: 18 January 2006
Posts: 2842

Posted: 15 January 2008 at 10:09pm | IP Logged

Originally posted by sareg


The bottom line(and not for lipservice only)

When in Rome, Do as Romans do LOL

 Can't really say that for USA and Canada. Smile Our constitution guarantees freedom of religion and freedom of expression which Rome never did. Wink  Btw that lady was Russian wasn't she. LOL

rockstallion Goldie
rockstallion
rockstallion

Joined: 17 July 2007
Posts: 1515

Posted: 16 January 2008 at 2:21am | IP Logged

Originally posted by qwertyesque

Originally posted by return_to_hades

I agree with the age old adage too 'When in Rome, do as the Romans do'

To me the most imperative thing in visiting a country is understanding the local culture and assimilating yourself within it. If you feel that you are unable to understand and assimilate then you should reconsider going there. Not necessarily.. Most asians are not even part of the Western main stream.. so living in that wierd delusion is better left alone..

I do not think assimilation is a compromise of personal morals or culture, but doing a balanced bit. I honestly do not think Canada is as extreme as making laws for people to dress skimpily.

Many westerners are fascinated with traditional outfits like sarees, salwar kameez and other unique and colorful clothing. They will willingly accept people wearing traditional clothing. However, westerners ultra conservative clothing like veils, feels restrictive and anti-social and feel unnerved when people insist on doing so. Ok they need to be trained to understand that a sikh in turban is no obama in disguise so if they use brains for a change instead of machines they would better understand that.. Peoples customs are not subject to local ignorance....

What irks many westerners is the fact that they will wear veils and headdresses when in a conservative country but these very people refuse to change a bit when they come in their country. Another annoying factor is the double standards. Pseudo conservative people coming rambling about the greatness of their culture yet ogling at western women and behaving in a lewd manner. Sure all these veiled people come with a brown color does that irk them too since you have taken up the role of western spokeswoman....LOL thank god they dont bleach them in their ire...

What also angers many westerners is that even if people want to preserve their culture why do they have to criticize western culture. I think this is more for seudo westerners. Americans dont really pwide that culture as much... but seudo's including abcd's sing a lot of praises fir a nonexistent culture So many people adapt a holier than thou attitude and look upon western people in a demeaning manner. Nobody looks down upon anyone but just pity the impoverished state of the same....Won't we be pissed if someone came to our country and looked down on our ways.Sure we do when people talk about indians eating monkey brains and land of snakes and elephants... sure we get irked too... 

Personally, I do not expect any radical changes. I believe Canada and United States are free countries and people should wear what they want. If a Middle Eastern woman wears the burkha that is her choice. I do not care. What needs to stop is cultural segregation. There is a whole wave of separate but equal sweeping through North America. Every immigrant community Indians, Asians, Middle Eastern, African, Latins, Slavs are all forming sub communities. They study and work together, but refuse to mingle with each other. Each is afraid of losing culture and refuses to socialize or assimilate with the rest of them. Children are encouraged to find friends within the same community, outsider friends are discouraged.

This needs to stop. We need to be social and share culture
.
There is good and bad in all cultural and cultural interaction is beneficial for society. People need to realize that culture will not get destroyed but will evolve for the next generation.

@ qwerty - Clapwanted to post the  underlined phrase too. Smile LOL

@hades - I am afraid you are not quite acquainted with the arab or middleeast culture, Its not just wearing veils and running away from men.  Mingling of men and women , mixed gatherings is not their culture, so its fine if they want to work in a burkha , make some money and walk home, i dont see, what is a big culture segregation deal there!

most goriyaan walking on times square to work,  dont they quite mind their own businesses as well!!! so is it just for a mere 'hi' 'hello' which burkha ladies don't sport, they get labeled as culture stickers. ? ?

and hey , where are you, @bold. nobody is refusing to socialise. Shocked

and different people doing things deifferently makes their culture different , i dont see, how it will be called culture, if we share it Wink 

and sharing would mean.......

is ki topi us ke sar, us ka skirt .........LOL (we again got to the start of debate)

 

qwertyesque IF-Rockerz
qwertyesque
qwertyesque

Joined: 03 December 2006
Posts: 6124

Posted: 16 January 2008 at 6:49am | IP Logged
Originally posted by rockstallion

Originally posted by qwertyesque

Originally posted by return_to_hades

I agree with the age old adage too 'When in Rome, do as the Romans do'

To me the most imperative thing in visiting a country is understanding the local culture and assimilating yourself within it. If you feel that you are unable to understand and assimilate then you should reconsider going there. Not necessarily.. Most asians are not even part of the Western main stream.. so living in that wierd delusion is better left alone..

I do not think assimilation is a compromise of personal morals or culture, but doing a balanced bit. I honestly do not think Canada is as extreme as making laws for people to dress skimpily.

Many westerners are fascinated with traditional outfits like sarees, salwar kameez and other unique and colorful clothing. They will willingly accept people wearing traditional clothing. However, westerners ultra conservative clothing like veils, feels restrictive and anti-social and feel unnerved when people insist on doing so. Ok they need to be trained to understand that a sikh in turban is no obama in disguise so if they use brains for a change instead of machines they would better understand that.. Peoples customs are not subject to local ignorance....

What irks many westerners is the fact that they will wear veils and headdresses when in a conservative country but these very people refuse to change a bit when they come in their country. Another annoying factor is the double standards. Pseudo conservative people coming rambling about the greatness of their culture yet ogling at western women and behaving in a lewd manner. Sure all these veiled people come with a brown color does that irk them too since you have taken up the role of western spokeswoman....LOL thank god they dont bleach them in their ire...

What also angers many westerners is that even if people want to preserve their culture why do they have to criticize western culture. I think this is more for seudo westerners. Americans dont really pwide that culture as much... but seudo's including abcd's sing a lot of praises fir a nonexistent culture So many people adapt a holier than thou attitude and look upon western people in a demeaning manner. Nobody looks down upon anyone but just pity the impoverished state of the same....Won't we be pissed if someone came to our country and looked down on our ways.Sure we do when people talk about indians eating monkey brains and land of snakes and elephants... sure we get irked too... 

Personally, I do not expect any radical changes. I believe Canada and United States are free countries and people should wear what they want. If a Middle Eastern woman wears the burkha that is her choice. I do not care. What needs to stop is cultural segregation. There is a whole wave of separate but equal sweeping through North America. Every immigrant community Indians, Asians, Middle Eastern, African, Latins, Slavs are all forming sub communities. They study and work together, but refuse to mingle with each other. Each is afraid of losing culture and refuses to socialize or assimilate with the rest of them. Children are encouraged to find friends within the same community, outsider friends are discouraged.

This needs to stop. We need to be social and share culture
.
There is good and bad in all cultural and cultural interaction is beneficial for society. People need to realize that culture will not get destroyed but will evolve for the next generation.

@ qwerty - Clapwanted to post the  underlined phrase too. Smile LOL

@hades - I am afraid you are not quite acquainted with the arab or middleeast culture, Its not just wearing veils and running away from men.  Mingling of men and women , mixed gatherings is not their culture, so its fine if they want to work in a burkha , make some money and walk home, i dont see, what is a big culture segregation deal there!

most goriyaan walking on times square to work,  dont they quite mind their own businesses as well!!! so is it just for a mere 'hi' 'hello' which burkha ladies don't sport, they get labeled as culture stickers. ? ?

and hey , where are you, @bold. nobody is refusing to socialise. Shocked

and different people doing things deifferently makes their culture different , i dont see, how it will be called culture, if we share it Wink 

and sharing would mean.......

is ki topi us ke sar, us ka skirt .........LOL (we again got to the start of debate)

 

There are aspects to this. If I have to work in an office where all the women wear those veils - all of them - that would freak me out... Of course, there are instances where I have seen couple of these arabic women who took the veil off their face and spoke in most intelligent, eloquent, confident English I havent seen many asian talk like that... and yet that veil reflected their adherence to tradition - a mix which absolutely surprised me.. .so it doesnt have to be one or the other... some of these veils hide the ultra-modern mind-sets...which are in fact superior to the average american.....and that fits veri well in that "good america" we refer to...Smile



Edited by qwertyesque - 16 January 2008 at 6:50am

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