Draw Muhammad contest Taxas!!! WHY?? - Page 12

Posted: 8 years ago
Originally posted by K.Universe.





Well, change is not easy, especially in the Muslim world, especially in those that have authoritarian regimes. A couple of outspoken individuals here and there that one could count on fingers simply wouldn't do. They need to have demonstrations, boycotts, strikes, petitions, civil disobedience, whatever it takes to bring about a social change. They need to hold themselves accountable for the state they are in. If it is a medieval book that is responsible for their overall "backwardness", then it is they who should shun medieval practices that are making them regressive. The burden is on them. If they are too impotent to rebel, then no amount of outside "support" will help; definitely not taunts.





Nope, it takes one individual to start a movement. But the thing is, the legal machinery in most Islamic nations is stringently anti-atheist and ultra-vigilant towards the slightest sign of rebellion or subversion towards the entrenched norms. Which means a civilised, organised "mivement" is hardly possible in a State like, say, Saudi Arabia where blogger Badawi get 100 lashes and possibly a death sentence for his atheism.



Posted: 8 years ago
Originally posted by krystal_watz







Nope, it takes one individual to start a movement. But the thing is, the legal machinery in most Islamic nations is stringently anti-atheist and ultra-vigilant towards the slightest sign of rebellion or subversion towards the entrenched norms. Which means a civilised, organised "mivement" is hardly possible in a State like, say, Saudi Arabia where blogger Badawi get 100 lashes and possibly a death sentence for his atheism.




The ordinary Muslim might have nothing to do with these Salafi terrorists but what can they about it. Does an individual now become accountable for the actions of such elements just because they admit to following the same faith?

Aware Muslims denounce these Wahabbis as anti-Islamic.

Saudi had also punished those guys who made a video of poverty in SA. 


Edited by Druids - 8 years ago
Posted: 8 years ago
Nobody's saying every Muslim is to be held accountable for the ghastly deeds of taq'firi elements. In my last post I pointed out how and why the "moderate" Muslim's voice is largely subdued in a society governed by the Sharia law and its guardians, the mutawas. Edited by krystal_watz - 8 years ago
Posted: 8 years ago
Originally posted by K.Universe.


QL, you may have a point here. I am getting systematically desensitized to these psychoanalytic, behavioral therapy advancing esoteric posts so much so that I have very little resolve left now to "fight back" anymore. It is working!

 
Good to know! Now that you're progressing, I'll consider decreasing the 'therapy' sessions.😛


In your rush to learn about desensitization,you looked into the wrong area.I talked about the desensitization which occurs as a natural process among healthy humans and what you have been reading about is the deliberate desensitization to treat phobias.

To spare you the trouble of finding examples of it on your own,here are some.

http://www.psychwiki.com/wiki/PSY307-Desensitization


The trouble is, desensitization can happen in either ways.People get desensitized to what they're exposed to-both violence and non-violence.

To militant islamists who resort to violence in the name of religion,cold-hearted killings is not a matter that deserves a second thought.They are desensitized to violence to the degree that such killings are mere routine events.The people who live nearby are also more or less in the same situation.When exposed to beheadings and such on a frequent basis,they become less and less sensitive to the sight.Now if they were offered an invitation to join the jihad and take part in the killings,they won't object to it as much as a normal person would.The continuous exposure to the terror along with the preaching about its 'holiness' made their ethics change.That's how such groups dramatically gain figures.

If such militant mentality is not curbed from outside,soon the middle east will have a huge population of them.Tackling violence with violence if works would be only temporary because to them,what they are doing is a holy act,not deserving to be punished.They'll only retort with even more violence and the vicious circle will continue.

The only thing that would work is what worked with Catholic church, which was as bad.By continuously exposing them to the actions they find provocative,it will appear less and less provocative as time goes on,making them adapt to alternative response mechanisms, instead of violence.No action is inherently provocative in nature.The person who is subjected to a particular action is the one who decides how much provocative it is.Take this contest for example.To a militant,this act is provocative enough for a mass murder of the organizers.To a liberal Muslim,the act is still condemnable but not provocative enough to take a life.The response,not the action is what defines provocativeness.

Once you're desensitized to something,the change of mindset will never happen from within the population.Being a naturally occurring process stabilized by evolution,it works as a survival adaptation in those who are subjected to it.They will never feel a need to change on their own.The pressure to change should come from outside.That's inevitable.
Now that religious terrorism is such a pressing issue worldwide,many would realize the potential of similar movements in making Muslims broadminded.There's a good chance that they will become more frequent in the west and gradually,elsewhere. Of course there will be violence and bloodshed,but its magnitude will decrease gradually.Condemnation of the act need not change.Only the response to it.Drawing Muhammad can still be a sin but believers would find other means to protest than resorting to violence.The books like The Holy Blood and the Holy grail which attacked the core of Christianity didn't go without a storm.But there wasn't a massacre in the name of it.That's the reaction which is desired.



Edited by QuietlyLoud - 8 years ago
Posted: 8 years ago
Murders and Rape is as common as Sex all over the World Now.
Just like a Boy of only 17 told me the other day that Doing the Deed and Keeping the Good boy image infront of parents is more easy than i think.
Now,I've been friends with this boy and his Whole group for more than 4yrs.But never wanted to fit in the Group because i detest their Filthy ways of Popularity.
So,they assumed i didn't join them in their Wild Parties was because i was Scared to ruin my 'Good girl Image'...So,what happend to them?
they are,in your words,desensitised
This is what they see all over the TVs,Listen in the Radios,On their Mobiles...hell,even Ads nowadays promotes promiscuous Sex!
Now tell me if you think we should keep quiet about this And let half the world die with STDs!
Because ppl might have been "Desensitised" but Mother Nature is Not.
Likewise,the amount Rape and Murder cases are Rapidly increasing and are all over the News,
Are You Desensitised?Doesn't it Matter to you anymore?NO.It matters and we are still finding ways to stop it,because we know its wrong.
Logically, if 1.7 billion ppl picked up a Gun and started shooting Everyone and Anyone that population the would Decrease to perhaps 4 Billions in about a Month.But we are not doing this are we?Now because Of 7% of Muslims who have now dedicated their life to Terrorism more than Allah,we 93% percentage of Muslims have to keep quiet and Watch you Desensitise us?
7%of Muslims Represents our Religion and not the 93%?
And did you Ever,just once,thought that if Muslims were so strict and Powerful and Dangerous then why is It that Children in Gaza,Syria,palestine and so many other places Have to Beg for Help and just a Piece of Bread and not get anything other than Humiliation?
Where are Al-Qayda,Isis this and that Now?
Aren't they suppose to protect us if they are protecting Islam?
Dont you see the truth?Or have you been desensitised to our Pains?

I refuse to be desensitised by Blind People and Media.
I will Speak when i see something Wrong.
I will Go against Them.
And i will Say 'You're Wrong,You cant make me agree with you'
And i will protest However i can.
I will fight them with Logic and Word,because this is My_Freedom of opinion and Expression and
FREEDOM.OF.SPEECH


Posted: 8 years ago

Originally posted by QuietlyLoud




In your rush to learn about desensitization,you looked into the wrong area.I talked about the desensitization which occurs as a natural process among healthy humans and what you have been reading about is the deliberate desensitization to treat phobias.

To spare you the trouble of finding examples of it on your own,here are some.



But the cartoon drawing contests are attempts at deliberate desensitization, isn't that right? Isn't that the whole reason you brought up this "therapy" in the first place? So why are you talking about "natural process desensitization" now and accusing me that I was researching the wrong area?

And healthy individuals don't have phobias?

Originally posted by QuietlyLoud




The only thing that would work is what worked with Catholic church, which was as bad.




I asked for evidence. Instead I get the usual runaround. So tell me, how many times should one repeat this mantra ("systematic desensitization worked for Catholic church") in their head, for it to become "fact"?


Originally posted by QuietlyLoud




Once you're desensitized to something,the change of mindset will never happen from within the population. The pressure to change should come from outside



OK, since it is a "fact" now (that systematic desensitization worked for Christians of yore), who exactly applied this pressure to change the Christians (Catholic church), what steps did they follow to desensitize Christians (Catholic church) and where is/was this "outside" that you speak of when it came to desensitizing Christians (Catholic church)?



Edited by K.Universe. - 8 years ago
Posted: 8 years ago
The age of enlightenment: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Age_of_Enlightenment

The Age of Enlightenment is an era from the 1650s to the 1780s in which cultural and intellectual forces in Western Europe emphasized reason, analysis, and individualism rather than traditional lines of authority. It was promoted by philosophers and local thinkers in urban coffee houses, salons, and Masonic lodges. It challenged the authority of institutions that were deeply rooted in society, especially the Catholic Church; there was much talk of ways to reform society with toleration, science and skepticism.


I rest my case.

Posted: 8 years ago
Originally posted by K.Universe.





But the cartoon drawing contests are attempts at deliberate desensitization, isn't that right? Isn't that the whole reason you brought up this "therapy" in the first place? So why are you talking about "natural process desensitization" now and accusing me that I was researching the wrong area?
And healthy individuals don't have phobias?
I asked for evidence. Instead I get the usual runaround. So tell me, how many times should one repeat this mantra ("systematic desensitization worked for Catholic church") in their head, for it to become "fact"?
OK, since it is a "fact" now (that systematic desensitization worked for Christians of yore), who exactly applied this pressure to change the Christians (Catholic church), what steps did they follow to desensitize Christians (Catholic church) and where is/was this "outside" that you speak of when it came to desensitizing Christians (Catholic church)? 




Deliberate desensitization is when it is used in a therapy-when psychologists use it in an scheduled ,step-wise(someone asked about a three-step process,remember?) manner to cure debilitating fears and addictions.


Desensitization which occurs naturally is neither deliberate nor involuntary.It does not have a predetermined format or a fixed time period.The contribution of many exertions in the desired direction is what forces the change.All those 'provocations' need not be the same.They can differ in form or intensity,provided they are capable of inciting the same response.In this case,it doesn't have to be a contest,but something else they would find equally provocative or questioning the doctrine.Whether such discrete influences can be considered deliberate attempts to desensitize or not,hangs on a thin line.IMO Geller is just showing middle finger to Muslims and doesn't give a damn about making them more liberal.So it is not deliberate attempt as far as her intentions are concerned.Now if someone else hosts it with a realization of its potential,then it is.Deliberate or not,the contributers would influence the process more or less to the same degree.


And yes,people who have specific phobias are not healthy.It is a type of anxiety disorder.


The pressure to reform Roman Catholic Church came from the population which was not the part of Papal administrative circle-Those who suffered at the hands of Pope-heretics,scientists,philosophers,native people,gypsies and list goes on.Those who were not desensitized to violence but suffered the effects of it.These people challenged the papal authority and their right to define Christian doctrine.If it was not for these people and their exertions,the Church would have remained the same.Without these influences, it would never have changed on it own because violence was a survival mechanism to the Church-To gain and retain power,to oppress the challengers,to preach sacraments and to keep people in ignorance.





Edited by QuietlyLoud - 8 years ago
Posted: 8 years ago
Originally posted by ..FallAndFly..


An idea?
What?Our Prophet was A Person and we look up to him,follow his paths and you Criticising him is criticising our ways of life, Calling our Faith and ideals Stupid,pathetic and full of B.S with so much force and Hatered that you have to bring armed bikers infront of mosque with these 'peaceful' Cartoons is Not Ragging than i dont know what is.
  
These people purposely did this event on Friday when Muslims go & perform their Friday prayers. Interesting to see some people would rather sit outside a mosque annoying people who have done nothing wrong than go to Texas & help out flood or tornado victims who could used the extra help... And then they will say they are about freedom and peace when all they do is spread hatred and then moan for what they have caused by playing the victim...


Posted: 8 years ago
Originally posted by krystal_watz


On "change from within":

Taslima Nasreen, Salman Rushdie, Wafa Sultana, Ayan Hirsi Ali, Washiqur Rahman are a few names to mention. What they did, and what was done unto them.

Freedom to criticize is allowed, as long as its with a spirit of seeking the truth & having an honest and respectable dialogue, but people are abusing freedom by inciting hatred through continuous disrespect, provocation, mockery, slander, hate speech, fear-mongering, & outright insults to our beliefs. 

Salman Rushdie rushed out of a party with his wife because some reporter made some obscene remark about his wife. If he can't tolerate a remark made to his wife how does he expect us to tolerate such bad remarks about our Prophet in the name of freedom of speech? Queen of England gave him "knighthood" for dissing Islam & Muslims. He said the hijab "suck" & are "limitation of women".. Well, what's on our head shouldn't be anyone's concern, care what's in it..  

Taslima Nasreen - What happened to her has nothing to do with Islam. Instead of hating her relatives that raped her, she started hating Islam & the Prophet. She even said female infanticide in Bangladesh is high due to "Islam"? Quran clearly prohibits such behaviour so why lie? She also said that Islam is demeaning towards woman? 

While speaking about Muslim women, she forgot that the country she came from had 2 women as PM - Khaleda Zia & Sheikh Hasina. Dr. Zakir Naik have openly challenged many people to debate with him about Islam. He challenged Taslima too, but she did not accept the challenge, knowing that if she did, her lies & knowledge about Islam will be exposed..

Another fake, idiotic, paid loser Ayaan Hirsi. There is a video on YT not from Muslims but from Dutch TV where she admitted that she lied about some info in a Dutch program. The program provided evidence that she's a liar. She lied about her name, her bg, her family, Islam & Somali culture. She lied to gain financially by writing books & films full of lies & fiction stories and fame.. 

Wafa Sultana is another liar. No offence but anyone who aligns themselves with Pamela Geller have to be mentally disturbed. ...

People like Rushdie, Taslima and their ilk are one & the same. Evil people with venom in their hearts. They lie about Islam, insult & ridicule prophetic figures for cheap publicity and to sell their books. They know the media is gonna pop up anything & everything bad if it is against Islam. Charlie Hebdo sales increased from 30,000 to 7 million copies.. These days people are willing to stoop any low for money. Ethics have gone out of the window. 

Not to mention these hypocrites doesn't even allow religion to be freely expressed but wants to allow it to be freely mocked...

Well, lie all you want about Islam, mock, insult, burn Holy books, draw cartoons, it is not gonna bring down Islam.. Peace..
http://5pillarsuk.com/2015/02/22/increase-in-muslim-converts-in-france-after-charlie-hebdo/

Edited by Qirat. - 8 years ago

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