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What was Karna's point of no return as far as his enmity w/ the Pandav

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TheWatcher thumbnail
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Posted: 10 years ago

Originally posted by: .Vrish.



Mishti

There were 8 people who gave her 5/5.  Most gave her 0, and a few gave her a 3 on the grounds that although she was no mother to Karna, she was a good mother to the Pandavas.  Even on that one, I disagree - I had given her a 1, not a 0.



She wasnt a good mother to Pandavas?, Give a few reason so that my hate towards her can intensify
...Diala... thumbnail
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Posted: 10 years ago

Originally posted by: .Vrish.


Why?  I thought there were really only 2 clear choices, although I listed many.  Karna being adopted by Adiratha didn't mean that he had to be the enemy of the Pandavas - did it?  After all, even the real Adiratha is not known to have had any animosity towards Pandu.


Originally posted by: .Vrish.


True, but had Kunti revealed this to him b4 the tournament somehow, he'd not have made enemies of the Pandavas.  Maybe in that event, he may have chosen to be a charioteer, or move out of Hastinapur or wherever he lived to some place else.


Ok I understood the question as getting back to Kunti as his son... as no return..
Edited by ...Diala... - 10 years ago
...Diala... thumbnail
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Posted: 10 years ago

Originally posted by: ...Diala...

there is an interesting take on when exactly Karna felt that Kunti came with a selfish motive as a mother of the legal 5.. I dont agree with that fully but found that to be interesting 😊  will share with citation...



Here it is.. @bold.. this is where the author feels Karna understood Kunti came as a mother of Pandavas.. because she speaks as if she is giving him what belonged to Yudishtra/Arjuna... thoughts?

"Kunti said, 'Thou art Kunti's son, and not Radha's. Nor is Adhiratha thy father. Thou, O Karna, art not born in the Suta order. Believe what I say. Thou wert brought forth by me while a maiden. I held thee first in my womb. O son, thou wert born in the palace of Kuntiraja. O Karna, that divine Surya who blazeth forth in light and maketh everything visible, O foremost of all wielders of weapons, begat thee upon me. O irresistible one, thou, O son, wert brought forth by me in my father's abode, decked with (natural) ear-rings and accoutred in a (natural) coat of mail, and blazing forth in beauty. That thou, without knowing thy brothers, shouldst, therefore, from ignorance, wait upon Dhritarashtra's son, is not proper. It is improper in thee especially, O son. The gratification of one's father and one's mother, who is the sole displayer of affection (for her child), hath, O son, in the matter of ascertaining the duties of men, been declared to be the highest of all duties. Acquired formerly by Arjuna, the prosperity of Yudhishthira hath, from avarice, been wrested by wicked persons. Snatching it back from Dhritarashtra's sons, do thou enjoy that prosperity. Let the Kurus behold today the union of Karna and Arjuna. Beholding thee and thy brother united together in bonds of brotherly love, let those wicked persons bow down unto ye. Let Karna and Arjuna be named in the same breath as Rama and Janardana. If you two are united together, what cannot be accomplished in the world? O Karna, surrounded by thy brothers, thou wilt, without doubt, blaze forth like Brahma Himself, surrounded by the gods on the platform of a great sacrifice. Endued with every virtue, thou art the first of all my relations. Let not the epithet Suta's son attach to thee. Thou art a Partha, endued with great energy.'"

Sea-Hawk thumbnail
Posted: 10 years ago

Originally posted by: ...Diala...

there is an interesting take on when exactly Karna felt that Kunti came with a selfish motive as a mother of the legal 5.. I dont agree with that fully but found that to be interesting 😊  will share with citation...


interesting idea .. In Rabindranath Thakur (Tagore)'s Poetry "Karna Kunti Sangbaad" it was beautifully written when Kunti's showcase of love n tears failed she tried to allure Karna saying he is the lawful owner of Hatinapoor Throne n Pandavas will serve him if he comes to their side. It is then Karna replied .. One who just rejected the love of mother, you are offering him the riches n throne!!!

In Tagore's Poetry Kunti is not as much as a cruel politician as Vyasa's Kunti is .. She is all busy to shower her love .. how she was a son-less mother even with 5 sons but even here the moment she offers the throne after getting rejected from Karna once, it seems the mask fell down n she starts for lamenting how her mistake will cause his sons' (Pandava's) death
...Diala... thumbnail
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Posted: 10 years ago

Originally posted by: TheWatcher



She wasnt a good mother to Pandavas?, Give a few reason so that my hate towards her can intensify


I just know one.. she dropped just born baby Bhima from her hands 😡
Vr15h thumbnail
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Posted: 10 years ago

Originally posted by: ...Diala...


Yeah my CSK.. wish I get a share of profits 😆.. 


hey but I think I should be #2 if sorted A-Z on MS Excel.. 😛



I have no idea why Excel puts you below _Angrybird_   I did sort it repeatedly, but couldn't change.  Try copying that list to an Excel sheet & see what you get after doing an A-Z sort
panchaali thumbnail
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Posted: 10 years ago
Wow I am just in love with the first pic of the AT 😳 and of course in love with Arya ❤️ 
...Diala... thumbnail
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Posted: 10 years ago
Vrish... this is what I get... 

-Shani- 
...Diala...
..Preethz.. 
.KSGSADDSMVMSK.
_AngryBird_  
A.Theepa  
Abhishek_King  
adithyan   
Aquabutterfly
Archanapajit
Astoria  
Bamonforever 
Brishti_Sarkar
candidfrisky 
DoppelgangerCAT  
Havvii  
JeanPaul
kash_meet10  
ketan_jha  
Krittz  
lpriya88
MaddyO
--MimiGupta--  
mirchy  
mmroyalkaterick
mocking_bird
Moumimon  
ojaswiniprinces
panchaali  
Patrarekha   
Proud-India  
rangeeni  
Redrose07  
rishbalaa
Rishi_
riti4u  
Rorschach  
RoseWine  
Sabhayata  
SayaneeH.Lecter  
sayee 
sayeed87  
shani88
simplysappie  
sravss  
srishtisingh  
Sukanya_Datta 
-Swetha- 
Thenewguy
TheWatcher  
tistaa  
VasusenaRadheya
Vibhishna
viji2111


Edited by ...Diala... - 10 years ago
panchaali thumbnail
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Posted: 10 years ago

Originally posted by: TheWatcher



She wasnt a good mother to Pandavas?, Give a few reason so that my hate towards her can intensify


She made them hate their eldest brother for years, she made Arjuana guilty forever for slaying his own brother- that's enough reason she was not a good mother to pandavas as well..
Vr15h thumbnail
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Posted: 10 years ago

Originally posted by: TheWatcher

She wasnt a good mother to Pandavas?, Give a few reason so that my hate towards her can intensify



A few things:
  1. She certainly lacked faith in them.  Despite Bhima's victory over Karna, she still felt that Karna could kill all of them.  What sort of a mother doesn't have faith in the power of her own sons?
  2. It was considered an honor for a kshatrani woman to have her sons die in battle.  From the Pandava side alone, Sudeshna, Draupadi, Subhadra, Hidimba, and several other women all lost all their sons.  Kunti goes crying to Karna that she doesn't want to lose any of hers.  What sort of a Kshatrani was she?  And what was so special about her that all her sons had to live, even while her grandsons died?
    • On one hand, she asks Krishna to tell the Pandavas that the time for which a Kshatrani gives birth has arrived.  In which case, she should happily accept it if she loses her sons in battle.  How is it fine for her to lose grandsons, who are the long term future of her family, but not her sons?
  3. Her living in Hastinapur despite the Pandava exile showed how shameless she was.  Had she any honor, she'd have gone back to Kuntibhoj.  Or Vasudeva.  Similarly, after the war, her retiring w/ D&G was a violation of Manu's laws, which required widows to live under the care of their sons, not BILs.
  4. Her keeping Karna's identity a secret from the Pandavas, thereby causing them to do the adharm of killing him.  I thought moms were supposed to protect their sons from adharm.  Instead, by never speaking up despite several opportunities, Kunti made adharmis out of Arjun & Yudisthir.  If she was gonna open up to Karna, she should have done the same to her sons b4 that, and asked them to apologize to him.  B4 the exile or the game of dice or any of that.  She was Rajmata of Indraprastha for several years, and never thought of setting her sons on the right path?
Point 3 is what I loathe most about her, followed closely by 4.

But nobody can loathe Kunti more than me.  I dare you 😈😆