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Arvind Kejriwal and AAP (Page 10)

return_to_hades IF-Sizzlerz
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Posts: 24303

Posted: 22 January 2014 at 1:25pm | IP Logged

@Genie

 

I know that police officers are corrupt. There are many ordinary employees in government posts that do harass other ordinary people demanding bribes for processing simple paperwork. Police officers are even known to harass innocent civilians threatening arrest/legal action if bribes are not paid. There are various reasons for this systematic corruption in many levels. While corruption should be investigated, punished and eradicated, I maintain that the employee is still an ordinary person whose rights and privileges must be protected.

 

I agree that cops should be held accountable for their duties. If there are reasonable and serious doubts on a cops integrity there should be thorough investigation. Unfortunately, AAP didn't conduct themselves in the right manner. They demanded retribution for failure of cops to comply with the law ministers illegal raid. It came off as stubborn and petulant retaliation rather than a sincere effort to punish corruption in the force.

 

I was unaware that the constitution demanded suspension of those under investigation. Seems counter intuitive to innocent until proven guilty. Strips protection in case of false charges. If that is the law though, it should be followed. However, the investigation should be over reasonable doubts over integrity not failure to comply with the whims of a law minister.

 

Refusal to comply with an illegal raid should never have been the trigger to seek action. The proper thing to do would have been to present reasonable doubt and demand suspension pending investigation. AAP's intent indeed maybe more noble and genuine. Their actions maybe solely to target corruption. But ends don't justify the means. Political bullying is political bullying no matter which party does it for whatever reason. If AAP wants to preserve credibility and goodwill they should end these risqu measures that come off as stubbornness, anarchism and bullying.

 

It is wrong whenever a person in power suspends people on their whims. People should have objected to Shinde's suspensions too. But just because Shinde wasn't protested doesn't mean people should keep mum now. People probably didn't expect integrity from him, but they do from AAP because AAP promised integrity.

 

I'm not saying throw the rulebook. But have everyone adhere to the rulebook civilians, cops, politicians and even AAP.

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DiehardYMfan

charminggenie IF-Stunnerz
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Posts: 27512

Posted: 22 January 2014 at 1:51pm | IP Logged
And this is why I have been saying all through- Law Minister was wrong in his approach and his vigilante role not intent. AK should have fired him or suspended him before demanding control over police and the suspension of cops.
I don't think there is any harm in a well intentional suspension ,  they are only done when a compliant is filed and on prima facie if there is evidence supporting it. The accused is not punished/detained/strip searched/ humiliated , he is in most cases sent on a paid leave/transfer of department till his reports are checked and a decision is not taken on his case. On many cases a police officer is removed from a case , if evidence emerges that he may have some personal interests in it. Right now too, the talked about policemen are sent on a paid holiday which they were already due while charges against them are investigated. Earlier Home Ministry denied that even. Keeping aside the raid case what about the two other cases where there were enough proof against the cops.

I can understand people's expectations towards AAP but I feel most are being on an emotional rollar-coaster and not understanding the political dynamics. AK would have earned way more supporters if he had pulled his Minister out for the wrong approach , he didn't and there lies his foil. Be real with AAP , not too idealist or too hopeful that they can form the central govt or change governance overnight.

They were dharna conducting activists far too long and they would need some time before they get a hang of administration etiquette. Don't judge a  party during the build-up phase of LS polls, especially a one which was not even on the table couple of months back, currently  there are lot many survival strategies at play which might backfire on AAP like this one. So give them the benefit of error and learn. 
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Posted: 22 January 2014 at 2:52pm | IP Logged

@Genie

 

My biggest skepticism of the AAP was their ability to legislate. The party is made up of many accomplished intelligent people. They are great social activists and campaigners. However, the question remains - can good activists make capable legislators?

 

I don't expect AAP to make any big dents or changes. I don't expect them to change Delhi overnight. I am impressed at some of the few things they accomplished like curbing the tanker mafia. I didn't expect them to do it as soon as they did. My actual expectations are simple. Simply be a party of integrity and focus on governing. Think before acting and speaking. Most importantly don't do anything of questionable legality no matter what the rationale. It is high time they stopped acting like activists and became good legislators. It is natural for people to be disheartened of the party just keeps doing tamasha.

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DiehardYMfan

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Posted: 22 January 2014 at 6:39pm | IP Logged
Originally posted by charminggenie

@Mr A - Vote share is always so confusing , well atleast for me. Lets  talk about the numbers. I feel anything around 200 for BJP would be a good position. It has Shiv Sena, maybe AIADMK, Akalis , Chandra Babu, maybe even BJD. They can sail through the vote of thanks easily and without needing MAmta or anyone else. 
Doubt SP will get many seats , BSP might  - gain few. CPI/CPM  ( West Bengal, Kerela )- 40 odd number.



look, bjp can get about 190 seats by sleeping. but wait for the REAL campaign to take off. even in karnataka, orissa, punjab,tamil nadu  he will do well.

with a proper modi for pm campaign, he will get about 210 seats.

akali and sena will give them abt 22, jaya and chandrababu can give then abt 35.. and they can manage a few more here and there.

with aap cutting the socialist, "secular" and minority vote,  bjp can gain an extra 20 - 30 seats, so 230 to 240 is possible. then even with existing allies the nda can get absolute majority.

if the modi wave is overrated, then bjp can get only 170 seats, max 180.

but if it is underrrated, then bjp can by itself get 272+ !!

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DiehardYMfan

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Posted: 22 January 2014 at 9:07pm | IP Logged
RTH: Not to mention, the corruption helpline, despite all reservations, is a roaring success. With 70% of the complaints against cops, if I may add. LOL

Edited by krystal_watz - 22 January 2014 at 9:15pm

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charminggenie

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Posted: 23 January 2014 at 1:55am | IP Logged
Originally posted by mr.ass

Originally posted by charminggenie

@Mr A - Vote share is always so confusing , well atleast for me. Lets  talk about the numbers. I feel anything around 200 for BJP would be a good position. It has Shiv Sena, maybe AIADMK, Akalis , Chandra Babu, maybe even BJD. They can sail through the vote of thanks easily and without needing MAmta or anyone else. 
Doubt SP will get many seats , BSP might  - gain few. CPI/CPM  ( West Bengal, Kerela )- 40 odd number.



look, bjp can get about 190 seats by sleeping. but wait for the REAL campaign to take off. even in karnataka, orissa, punjab,tamil nadu  he will do well.

with a proper modi for pm campaign, he will get about 210 seats.

akali and sena will give them abt 22, jaya and chandrababu can give then abt 35.. and they can manage a few more here and there.

with aap cutting the socialist, "secular" and minority vote,  bjp can gain an extra 20 - 30 seats, so 230 to 240 is possible. then even with existing allies the nda can get absolute majority.

if the modi wave is overrated, then bjp can get only 170 seats, max 180.

but if it is underrrated, then bjp can by itself get 272+ !!
Not to mention Mamata who is ready to trade outside support for the Bengal package which she is demanding from the centre..this package will surely boost her credibility and make up for more than the so-called loss she will endure by outside support to the BJP!
charminggenie IF-Stunnerz
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Posted: 23 January 2014 at 10:31am | IP Logged
Originally posted by mr.ass

Originally posted by charminggenie

@Mr A - Vote share is always so confusing , well atleast for me. Lets  talk about the numbers. I feel anything around 200 for BJP would be a good position. It has Shiv Sena, maybe AIADMK, Akalis , Chandra Babu, maybe even BJD. They can sail through the vote of thanks easily and without needing MAmta or anyone else. 
Doubt SP will get many seats , BSP might  - gain few. CPI/CPM  ( West Bengal, Kerela )- 40 odd number.



look, bjp can get about 190 seats by sleeping. but wait for the REAL campaign to take off. even in karnataka, orissa, punjab,tamil nadu  he will do well.
Orissa has a strong BJD - doubt BJP can make a big dent. Karnataka - lets see which way the Yedurappa factor takes them. Punjab was always BJP-Akali. TN- Jaya Amma

with a proper modi for pm campaign, he will get about 210 seats. Very Likely

akali and sena will give them abt 22, jaya and chandrababu can give then abt 35.. and they can manage a few more here and there.

with aap cutting the socialist, "secular" and minority vote,  bjp can gain an extra 20 - 30 seats, so 230 to 240 is possible. then even with existing allies the nda can get absolute majority.

if the modi wave is overrated, then bjp can get only 170 seats, max 180. - safe number, still respectable.

but if it is underrrated, then bjp can by itself get 272+ ! thats an unlikely number, too many regional players at work

I don't want Mamta anywhere near centre. It would be interesting to see how BJP performs in UP, Bihar and Andhra . Those states hold the key!
heeheehee Groupbie
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Posted: 23 January 2014 at 7:27pm | IP Logged
Sagarpur dowry
victim gets some
justice after a week
NEW DELHI: The day
chief minister Arvind
Kejriwal began his
dharna outside Rail
Bhavan, demanding that
some policemen,
including one dealing
with an alleged dowry
burning case in
Sagarpur, be
suspended, the victim,
Neha, would have
celebrated her 29th
birthday. However, she
was fighting for her life
at Safdarjung Hospital
with 45% burns.
Within 24 hours of the
CM voicing his demand,
Neha's mother-in-law,
Sumitra, sister-in-law
Reena and brother-in-
law Rajbir were
arrested from their
hideout in Dwarka. The
father-in-law, Abhay, is
already in custody.
The crime took place
eight days ago in
Sagarpur's Indra Park in
west Delhi. She would
have been just another
victim of dowry and
domestic violence in
police records had
Delhi's women and child
development minister,
Rakhi Birla, not got
involved. Neha's father,
Virender Yadav, was at
the protest site since
Monday, asking for
suspension of the
Sagarpur SHO.
Neha has burns mainly
on her neck, chest and
waist. This wasn't the
first time that this 29-
year-old was tortured
and physically abused,
alleges her family. Her
six-year-old son, Rohit,
was present when she
was set on fire.
"Sometimes, he recalls
the incident and gets
scared," says her
younger brother,
Kuldeep Yadav. Rohit
has stopped going to
school for now.
Neighbours had more
horrifying tales of
abuse. Owning four
houses in the same lane
of the unauthorized
colony, Abhay and
Sumitra have two sons,
Rajbir and Sonu. Both
were handling two
shops selling electronic
goods. Neha's in-laws
lived in one house, while
Rajbir and his wife lived
above the shops in
another house. Sonu
and Neha were in the
third house and the
fourth one was given
out on rent. Police
constables having tea
at their shops was a
regular sight.
The first-warning signal
was "when they
demanded a car and Rs
1.11 lakh as dowry,"
said Kuldeep, "but
demanding dowry is
common." However,
demands for more
money didn't stop and,
after Neha had her first
kid, a daughter, who is
now nine years old, the
family alleges that it
was asked to give Rs 2
lakh. "Since she had a
daughter, we had to
pander to their needs,"
said Kuldeep, an MBA
student.
In November 2008,
Neha was beaten up so
badly that she was
rushed to hospital. By
that time, she was a
mother of two kids- a
daughter and son. Still,
she didn't go back to
her parents' home in
Samalkha Village,
Kapashera. "She neither
returned, nor left her
husband as she was a
mother and wanted to
fight for the rights of
her children," said Sudhir
Yadav, Neha's elder
brother.
By 2010, Sonu had gone
to Dubai to work,
leaving his family
behind. He wasn't
present on the day of
the incident and the FIR
doesn't mention him.
"He wasn't sending any
money and the in-laws
were not helping her
financially. So, Neha
started her own
boutique, but it was her
parents who paid the
school fee of her kids,"
said Madhu, her
neighbour.
The neighbours said
that after 11 years of
marriage, Neha would
still come out with a
ghoonghat covering her
face. "When was set on
fire, the red stole
covering her head began
burning and got stuck
to her skin." But the
incident didn't shock the
hardened
neighbourhood. Such
things happen in
Sagarpur. Three days
back, a woman, around
30 years old, was found
dead with her throat
slit, cops told TOI.
After Sonu left, four
cameras were installed
outside her house to
keep a watch on her,
the family alleges. Last
month, the iron gate of
her house was brought
down. "We approached
the cops after the gate
was removed but they
didn't register our
complaint," said Sudhir.
"In fact, the beat
constable was present
when the gate was
removed. The cameras
had been switched off
when the incident took
place."
Neha's parents
approached an NGO in
Dwarka, who turned to
Rakhi Birla on January
10. "Rakhi spoke to my
sister over the phone
and assured us that
help would be provided.
But her sister-in law got
to know about it. And
three days later on
January 13, everyone
knows what
happened," he said.
The Sagarpur cops
arrested Abhay Yadav
the night of the incident
while the rest were
arrested only on
Tuesday, after a lot of
pressure. "The four
accused have been
arrested under IPC
307/34 (attempt to
murder with common
intention)," said a senior
police officer. Since the
in-laws are behind bars,
they couldn't be reached
for their version.
Sagarpur dowry victim
gets some justice after
a week - Times Of India

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