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varaali

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varaali

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Posted: 26 November 2013 at 12:14am | IP Logged
Originally posted by .Vrish.



Finally, in the precap for tomorrow, Karna & Arjun are shown fighting, and Arjun's arrows get dissipated by Karna's armor, which is when it becomes visible to Kunti.  But in the original, Karna was denied a fight: it was after Karna was crowned that Adirath congratulated him, and the caste question saw to it that a fight didn't happen.  That was why Karna became a lifelong friend - he wanted a battle w/ Arjun, which he got to have @ Draupadi's swayamvara, Matsya, and finally Kurukshetra.  But had Karna gotten the opportunity that they're gonna show him get tomorrow, he'd have been pretty satisfied.

Also, Kunti saw his armor & earrings first thing when he appeared, and recognized him.  It didn't become visible just b'cos Arjun's arrows failed to penetrate it.

Exactly. Arjuna and Karna did not fight because, Karna could not / would not divulge details of his caste, family etc. According to Kripacharya, the rangabhoomi was a place for the princes of the Kuru family to showcase their talents and a stranger could not wily nily take part in it - especially when the stranger was not from a royal family.

It was then that Duryodhana- seeing that Karna would be formidable antagonist to Arjuna - and seeing the value of friendship with such a person- decides to crown Karna the king of Anga- thus placing him on par with Arjuna.

But Kripacharya would have none of that. If someone wanted to challenge Arjuna, he had to born in a royal family- not be crowned in the nick of the moment.

Meanwhile Adhirath, getting news about his son's coronation, rushes to the venue where Bhima makes fun of Karna's parentage which infuriates Duryodhana further.

By this time, the sun had set and the proceedings for the day called off. 

Secondly, Karna's armour may have protected him from death, but it did not make him invincible. 
As Vrish noted, he lost to Arjuna at Draupadi's swyamvar, he lost to the gandharva Chitrasen and later on during the Matsya encounter.


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riti4u

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Posted: 26 November 2013 at 12:24am | IP Logged
i sort of agree to discussion here that mahabharat version which i too read in my school...i dont think karna n arjuna fight in this to prove who is superior..he comes bt he is nt allowed..n insulted..

.Vrish.

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Posted: 26 November 2013 at 12:36am | IP Logged
Also, Arjun was not the only one who could defeat Karna, contrary to what all the serials have shown to date.  During the Rajasuya yagna, Anga was one of the kingdoms subdued by the Pandavas, and that kingdom was subdued by Bhima.  Karna was undoubtedly the one defending that, and at that time, he didn't know Kunti, and was under no obligation not to kill Bhima if he could.  In fact, this was a golden opportunity for Karna to eliminate a key Pandava, but that didn't happen.

Also, during the 14th day, when Bhima & Karna fought a major battle, Karna was getting beaten badly, which is why Duryodhan sent a lot of his brothers, including Vikarna to defend him, and they all got slain by Bhima.  In the end, Karna was unable to defeat Bhima.  However, both remembered the respective vows and stopped attacking each other.  Bhima remembered that if he killed Karna, Arjun's vow would be voided, while Karna remembered his promise to Kunti.  The serials just show the latter, but Karna actually got the worst of it.

Also, on day 17, when Karna wounded Yudisthir & forced him to retreat from the field, sparing his life, Bhima was infuriated @ the insult & knocked Karna senseless in his chariot.  Shalya reminded him that Karna was Arjun's target, not Bhima's, and so Bhima withdrew, & proceeded to Duhshashan.

Oh, and add to that - both Satyaki and Abhimanyu never lost a battle to Karna.  On day 14, Satyaki penetrated Karna and moved on, until his battle w/ Bhurishrava.  Karna lost to Abhimanyu in each of their encounters.

If one has to rank all the sons of Kunti on battle prowess, it would probably go like Bhima, Arjun, Karna, Yudisthir, Nakul & Sahadev, in that order.


Edited by .Vrish. - 26 November 2013 at 12:46am

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varaali

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Posted: 26 November 2013 at 1:01am | IP Logged
Originally posted by .Vrish.


If one has to rank all the sons of Kunti on battle prowess, it would probably go like Bhima, Arjun, Karna, Yudisthir, Nakul & Sahadev, in that order.

I would rank Arjuna higher than Bhima. Arjun had the mental capability and requisite powers of concentration to summon and use the divyastras. Bhima was no doubt very good, but all he had was brute force. 

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varaali

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Posted: 26 November 2013 at 1:34am | IP Logged
Oh- there was one occasion where Karna may got the better of Arjuna- in fact Karna would have probably killed Arjuna. That was when he aimed the Nagastra at Arjuna. Krishna who identified the astra as soon as it left Karna's bow yanked the horses and forced them  to bend at their knees. As a result the astra only hit Arjuna's crown / helmet 

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.Vrish.

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Posted: 26 November 2013 at 1:38am | IP Logged
^^^ 17th day, shortly b4 Karna's death

Reason I rated Bhima higher was not just his raw power, but that he generally took on the toughest of enemies, and pulled out friends from dire situations.  Like when Ashwatthama released the Narayanastra on the Pandavas following the death of Drona, the entire Pandava army surrendered b4 it, but Bhima decided to be the sole challenger, so that the astra stopped threatening anyone else, and moved @ him instead.

There's a reason Jarasandha picked Bhima over Arjun as to who he wanted to fight.

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.Vrish.

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Posted: 26 November 2013 at 4:34pm | IP Logged
Today's twist - aside from Duryodhan's open insult to Kunti LOL - Dhritarashtra declaring Karna the king of Anga, & then rooting for him over Arjun.  Actually, it was Duryodhan who declared Karna the king of Anga, and Bhima did not contest that, since until he knew that Karna was a suta, he had no issues w/ Arjun battling Karna

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koolsadhu1000

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Posted: 26 November 2013 at 5:26pm | IP Logged
This is how i read it

Karna lost against Virata war , Chitrasena 

but

it is clearly mentioned in the Mahabharat that he spared

Bhima , Yudhishtir and Nakul . Even Arjun , in the Nagastra episode .

Regarding Abhimanyu he has fought him only in the war . Even his son Vrishasen has fought very bravely , even pierced Krishna with his arrows and almost killed Nakul .

It is clearly mentioned in the Mahabharat that Yudhishtir was so humiliated by Karna's defeat that when he heard the news of Karnas death he wanted to see his dead body . He went to the battlefield with his brothers to be sure and was happy when he saw him slain ...clearly mentioned .

Krishna has urged Arjun to strike when he was out of the chariot saying u will never be able to slay him otherwise . Kill him before he gets back in the chariot . This can be interpreted in 2 ways

Karna had a boon that no one could kill him so long he was in chariot

It speaks of the might of him as a formidable opponent .

When Karna has held his hand up and implored Arjun to follow the rules of war and not shoot Krishna has asked him where his knowledge of the rules went when he joined in killing Abhimanyu .

As i see it

win some

lose some 

That s Karna's life ...he did not perhaps win all the time against the Pandavas but was a very formidable force and gave them a tough fight .




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