Debate Mansion

   

Is Karvachauth wrong? (Page 6)

Post Reply New Post

Page 6 of 15

joie de vivre

Goldie

joie de vivre

Joined: 18 January 2007

Posts: 1239

Posted: 30 October 2013 at 2:25pm | IP Logged
Originally posted by AishuHiBawari


But do you see what you are doing here? You are saying that women should be like this, they should be like that. They should change their way of living just to make a point. You are creating rules for women, saying that they should do the opposite of what society expects them to do, and in that, you are imposing rules on them just like society is.

I am a feminist, and I believe that all women deserve respect regardless of what PERSONAL choices they make. Personal, as in, they are theirs to make alone. Whether or not a woman fasts doesn't affect anyone's life but hers, so it is HER choice. Selective abortion, raising her sons differently than her daughters, etc were NOT EVEN IN THE DISCUSSION. They don't relate to the topic at all. If she is selectively killing female babies, yes, that is wrong as hell. If she is treating her sons differently than her daughters, that is wrong too! But what she wears, whether she fasts, that doesn't affect anyone else, so how is that wrong? If she chooses to do it, then it's her business, not yours. In regards to the burkha: if a woman has the right to expose her body, she has the right to cover it. You cannot decide whether it is right or wrong.

Just because she chooses to fast, she chooses to wear a burkha, she chooses have a breast augmentation, that does not in any way mean that she is bowing down to patriarchy. There are so many different kinds of women out there! Open your eyes! And they should be able to make their own personal choices as long as they don't harm anyone else. And feminism seeks to impower women, regardless of whether they follow a certain faith or not. Karvachauth is a religious festival in which the woman fasts for the long life of a husband. You can say that there is inequality there, but it's not as if men don't fast for their wives. IN FACT, MANY MEN DO!


I think what the problem is that people keep making up rules for what a woman should do. Some say she should fast, some, like you, say that she shouldn't ever fast. But the idea behind feminism is that she should be able to do what she wants to do. Karvachauth is neither right nor wrong. It is simply a choice that should be left completely up to the woman who does it.

So basically in a nutshell, you're saying  "that all women are worthy of respect be default of being a woman and all of their choices are equally valid."

Sorry. Yeah, feminism is about choices, but not all choices are feminist choices. There is nothing feminist (or even remotely rational) about fasting for your husband's health (when he isn't required to do the same) or aborting a female foetus or getting a boob job or walking around in a black tent. Do it, if you must, but don't please don't justify your choice as a feminist one. Just because someone "feels good" doing something, doesn't mean they aren't doing their bit in sustaining the social status-quo. 


Edited by joie de vivre - 31 October 2013 at 1:21pm

The following 1 member(s) liked the above post:

Rehanism

Dear Guest, Being an unregistered member you are missing out on participating in the lively discussions happening on the topic "Is Karvachauth wrong? (Page 6)" in Debate Mansion forum. In addition you lose out on the fun interactions with fellow members and other member exclusive features that India-Forums has to offer. Join India's most popular discussion portal on Indian Entertainment. It's FREE and registration is effortless so JOIN NOW!

joie de vivre

Goldie

joie de vivre

Joined: 18 January 2007

Posts: 1239

Posted: 30 October 2013 at 2:32pm | IP Logged
Originally posted by K.Universe.



I think misogyny is too strong a word and is not applicable in this context. Inequality yes, but certainly not misogyny.

I followed the etymology of this festival and I don't see how a "hatred of women" or "sexual objectification of women" or "violence against women" led the then society to come up with this festival, unless you have factual evidence to the contrary, that some of us are not privy to.

Misogyny is used as a catch-all word when discussing women's second class status in societies. It doesn't strictly have to mean "woman hating" the same way racism isn't strictly about subscribing to the view that a certain race is superior to others. Sexual, like racial, discrimination is nuanced and subliminal and doesn't invariably mean a hatred of a women. 

charminggenie

IF-Rockerz

charminggenie

Joined: 28 December 2007

Posts: 6496

Posted: 30 October 2013 at 2:45pm | IP Logged
Originally posted by joie de vivre



So basically in a nutshell, you're saying  "that all women are worthy of respect be default of being a woman and all of their choices are equally valid."

Sorry. Yeah, feminism is about choices, but not all choices are feminist choices. There is nothing feminist (or even remotely rational) about fasting for your husband's health (when he isn't required to do the same) or getting a boob job or walking around in a black tent. Do it, if you must, but don't please don't justify your choice as a feminist one. Just because someone "feels good" doing something, doesn't mean they are doing their bit in sustaining the social status-quo. 
[/QUOTE]

Sorry for butting in ,but the point here is why should a woman's personal choices- whether to get a boob job, or fast for her husband , be interpreted as some social practice and be looked as having a negative impact on the whole of women-hood. 

Feminism to me would be letting a woman or a girl make her own choices for her own self, without external influences. Right or wrong is her prerogative. She is neither seeking a validation or a criticism for her choices. Respect her personal call, we might disagree with it but we cannot put down and say - '"she is being regressive, if she doesn't conform with our ideals!

I think at the end of the day it should be an open ended-choice! 


The following 1 member(s) liked the above post:

AishuHiBawari

K.Universe.

Goldie

K.Universe.

Joined: 02 September 2012

Posts: 1113

Posted: 30 October 2013 at 3:13pm | IP Logged
Originally posted by charminggenie

@ Mr. K- you really think women will wiki about karwa Chauth and decide about participating on the basis of it's definition.


If it made to Wiki without getting tagged, that would mean WikiProject ensured the use of verified, reliable source for the content.

Which means, that particular Wiki article would be reflecting reality.

In essence, what I meant in that post was to make my proposal (celebrate together, fast together, pray together) a reality. Simple as that.

As for choice, I agree that the choice is up to the individual, provided it doesn't manifest into a social ill and doesn't negatively impact the society.

Personally, I don't see this festival degenerating into a social ill and I didn't come across anyone who convinced me that it is a social ill. It might put pressure on those who do not want to participate but such pressures are a fact of life.


The following 1 member(s) liked the above post:

charminggenie

return_to_hades

IF-Veteran Member

return_to_hades

Joined: 18 January 2006

Posts: 20232

Posted: 30 October 2013 at 3:24pm | IP Logged

Karva chauth is it is popularly known and celebrated is a festival where the woman fasts for her husband's long life. Of course as times change many men do keep a fast with their wives or request that these traditions not be followed. But this is still a woman fasting for her man. It is an inequality.

 

While I respect a woman's choice to keep a fast, for society in the long term I would like to see either the festival end or evolve to something that is equal to both husband and wife.

 

This makes me wonder, can I fast for someone's short life. Ermm

charminggenie

IF-Rockerz

charminggenie

Joined: 28 December 2007

Posts: 6496

Posted: 30 October 2013 at 3:25pm | IP Logged
@Mr K- you really had to go all techno on me about wiki. Give this girl a break, I gave you a Raj from DDLJ, women in particular and men by default still follow that great man's footsteps.
Let that together be of choice, please. Now if some day in future, I refuse to keep the fast and my dearest other half, wants to participate, who am I to argue?. I will eat to my fullest and he can starve himself, that moment I won't appreciate your reality of togetherness. Just saying!

Same- Haven't come across any incident which has relegated this day as some social ill.

The following 1 member(s) liked the above post:

K.Universe.

K.Universe.

Goldie

K.Universe.

Joined: 02 September 2012

Posts: 1113

Posted: 30 October 2013 at 3:29pm | IP Logged
Originally posted by return_to_hades

This makes me wonder, can I fast for someone's short life. Ermm



HAHA

Another twist: if one partner in a gay or lesbian couple would like to fast for the 'longevity" of the other, would that still be categorized as inequality?

charminggenie

IF-Rockerz

charminggenie

Joined: 28 December 2007

Posts: 6496

Posted: 30 October 2013 at 3:35pm | IP Logged
Originally posted by return_to_hades

Karva chauth is it is popularly known and celebrated is a festival where the woman fasts for her husband's long life. Of course as times change many men do keep a fast with their wives or request that these traditions not be followed. But this is still a woman fasting for her man. It is an inequality.

 

While I respect a woman's choice to keep a fast, for society in the long term I would like to see either the festival end or evolve to something that is equal to both husband and wife.

 

This makes me wonder, can I fast for someone's short life. Ermm


Umm Don't think I agree with that Hades. The definition that you have given is way dated. The times and the situations it was made were different. This was never meant to be all about men, if you go by the folk tales that are exchanged during this festival , you would understand that all women talk are about themselves how Queen X and other women kept this fast when their husbands left for war. It was a choice then too! if you look at the actual Pooja, its always about the society women gathering together and exchanging that moment. This day was created to let them bond over a simple fact that their husbands have gone for long periods of war time.

Society and the festival itself has made it clear that its end or evolution is in an individual's hand.  The choice if keeping it together or not observing it, is very much open to all. So I really don't see it as an inequality!



Edited by charminggenie - 30 October 2013 at 3:43pm

Post Reply New Post

Go to top

Related Topics

  Topics Topic Starter Replies Views Last Post
Is God to blame for everything that has gone wrong

2 3 4 5 6 7

Summer3 53 3399 02 July 2013 at 1:08am
By Summer3
Why only killing a female embryo is wrong?

2 3 4 5 6 7 ... 11 12

The_Other_Woman 92 3363 01 February 2013 at 10:30am
By BirdieNumNum
Middleeast Crisis - Is something wrong somewhere ?

2

Summer3 12 849 20 March 2011 at 11:30pm
By Summer3
is it wrong to be quiet and reserved?

2 3 4

shalini1323 24 3295 10 July 2010 at 12:47am
By AttractiveAdya
when child artist plus fame go wrong

2 3 4 5

ana1 38 1642 15 May 2010 at 10:53pm
By return_to_hades

Forum Quick Jump

Forum Category

Active Forums

Debate Mansion Topic Index

Limit search to this Forum only.

 

Disclaimer: All Logos and Pictures of various Channels, Shows, Artistes, Media Houses, Companies, Brands etc. belong to their respective owners, and are used to merely visually identify the Channels, Shows, Companies, Brands, etc. to the viewer. Incase of any issue please contact the webmaster.