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return_to_hades

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Posted: 08 September 2013 at 10:59pm | IP Logged
Originally posted by mr.ass

^^ it seems you do not understand anything LOL  first calling modi communist and then saying you dont know what communism means! he is a hardcore capitalist.

there has not been any riots in the last 10 years in gujarat, so how anyone can even call him hitler is crazy.


After reading the post, I think there was a confusion between communal and communist.


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mr.ass

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mr.ass

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Posted: 09 September 2013 at 2:02am | IP Logged
Originally posted by return_to_hades

Originally posted by mr.ass

^^ it seems you do not understand anything LOL  first calling modi communist and then saying you dont know what communism means! he is a hardcore capitalist.

there has not been any riots in the last 10 years in gujarat, so how anyone can even call him hitler is crazy.


After reading the post, I think there was a confusion between communal and communist.





true that LOL  and the fact that there haven't been any riots for the last 11 years and the fact that hindus and muslims get along best in guj shows how "comunist" he is LOL

enigmatic_zephy

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Posted: 09 September 2013 at 7:46pm | IP Logged
Originally posted by mr.ass

Originally posted by return_to_hades

Originally posted by mr.ass

^^ it seems you do not understand anything LOL  first calling modi communist and then saying you dont know what communism means! he is a hardcore capitalist.

there has not been any riots in the last 10 years in gujarat, so how anyone can even call him hitler is crazy.


After reading the post, I think there was a confusion between communal and communist.





true that LOL  and the fact that there haven't been any riots for the last 11 years and the fact that hindus and muslims get along best in guj shows how "comunist" he is LOL

Big smile

people really really need to accept the fact that no god, allah, jesus is sitting in the void of universe, and on a lookout for his 'bandas'..LOL

People r so funny...do they really think on kailash, shivji stays with his family or that deep in the oceans, vishnu ji and his colony resides..adept at breathing underwater and sleeping with/on snakes..

and similarly for every other single religion..rediciulous..

aur phir ek doosre ke maarne aa jaate hain..mere bhagwaan ko kya kahan, tumhaare allah ko kya kaha..LOL..aao murder murder khelein LOL


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mr.ass

Bazigar

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Posted: 09 September 2013 at 9:29pm | IP Logged


Exactly but ,  RSS/BJP fanatics cant understand this, who indulge in the this killing game in the name of religion or our pm aspirant who prefer to identify himself on the basis of religion as hindu nationalist .LOL

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enigmatic_zephy

enigmatic_zephy

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Posted: 09 September 2013 at 11:35pm | IP Logged
Originally posted by ramjaane



Exactly but ,  RSS/BJP fanatics cant understand this, who indulge in the this killing game in the name of religion or our pm aspirant who prefer to identify himself on the basis of religion as hindu nationalist .LOL

h ehe..

but the thing is society has that inherent disconnect which is played on by the politicians..and its not a recent thing...but since forever..

The entire freedom struggle, it tuk 100 years because people were not united...small groups individually would raise their voice..not exaqctly align with each other ( yes lack of press and ocmmunication are also reason but not this big)...

1857 is important, because thats the first time hindu-muslim came together..and British knew very well that this should not happen again...

Nehru-Jinaah is also a result of that..

I know people say we are brothers and we can live in harmony...deep down i think society wants that..However, the sad truth is this too...the deep down there is some sort of disconnect too which is prevalent...

It comes out best when you read the freedom struggle rt from the time of modernists...and why society was not participating..till gandhi came..his achievement ofcourse being involvement of peasanty and thus the United India..

Even today, you and I might not do it..but overall in India there are issues...even between hindu/muslim..

and till the time society continues to harbour these feelings, someone or the other will always find a way to ruffle them and use it against them..


( Let's see what is now happening in Muzaffarnagar doen't spread)

ONUS is on us..


But yes, another thing to consider..

whoever has seen partition will not be able to get over that hate...( easy to say but close to impossible).. and hence, the role o fnew generation is so important..because it is free of all such budens..

But alas, youth in India ( and don't limit it to a few individuals) is still not participating nor is interested in state affairs...

yet, the good thing is..there is a definite rise in contribution from the youth although from specific corners...rise in NGOs, accepting home job offers, enterpreuership..et all...

only if we cud curb the evil side of corruption...complete elimination is impossible..


Edited by enigmatic_zephy - 09 September 2013 at 11:42pm

Bazigar

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Posted: 10 September 2013 at 12:15pm | IP Logged
1. In a multicultural, multireligious society always there is some difference , so also it have unity component.  It is wrong  to think that these are byproduct of partition horror if that is so then the most volatile should be the region which not only witness but majorly suffer the partition religious horror like West Bengal or in Punjab. If we look at history than Infact west bengal have no history of riots during 1992 when India witnessed riots all over.  The point is in recent history most of the major riots were not spontaneous , instead a manufactured one where different fanatic groups use the situation for furthering their cause . Blatantly they fanning the sectarian and religious conflict among people , try to polarise the society. 

2. Regarding british divide rule concept , our present generation, how we approach secularism is also interesting. A PM aspirant who want to be at the helm of the nation declare himself Hindu nationalist. We can witness many of our generation support his outlook. The way they paint the nationalism is interesting , shall a parsi declare himself as parsi nationalist, muslim declare he is muslim nationaltist, a christian as christian nationalist, like he declare he is hindu nationalist ?

Yes in the aim of  polarization of society certainly the divide rule product of British like RSS golwalikar  etc. declare themselves as hindu nationalist, but we never hear a  Bhagat Singh declare himself as Sikh nationalist or a chandra sekhar azad hindu nationalist or a Ashafaqulla khan as muslim nationalist or related to the thread heading surname M K Gandhi himself as hindu nationalist. 



Edited by ramjaane - 10 September 2013 at 12:47pm

BirdieNumNum

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Posted: 10 September 2013 at 12:59pm | IP Logged
Originally posted by ramjaane

1. In a multicultural, multireligious society always there is some difference , so also it have unity component.  It is wrong  to think that these are byproduct of partition horror if that is so then the most volatile should be the region which not only witness but majorly suffer the partition religious horror like West Bengal or in Punjab. If we look at history than Infact west bengal have no history of riots during 1992 when India witnessed riots all over.  The point is in recent history most of the major riots were not spontaneous , instead a manufactured one where different fanatic groups use the situation for furthering their cause . Blatantly they fanning the sectarian and religious conflict among people , try to polarise the society. 

2. Regarding british divide rule concept , our present generation, how we approach secularism is also interesting. A PM aspirant who want to be at the helm of the nation declare himself Hindu nationalist. We can witness many of our generation support his outlook. The way they paint the nationalism is interesting , shall a parsi declare himself as parsi nationalist, muslim declare he is muslim nationaltist, a christian as christian nationalist, like he declare he is hindu nationalist ?

Yes in the aim of  polarization of society certainly the divide rule product of British like RSS golwalikar  etc. declare themselves as hindu nationalist, but we never hear a  Bhagat Singh declare himself as Sikh nationalist or a chandra sekhar azad hindu nationalist or a Ashafaqulla khan as muslim nationalist or related to the thread heading surname M K Gandhi himself as hindu nationalist. 


totally disagree on all fronts. Read up on the partition. Riots started in Kolkata. That's Bengal. At least get your facts right. Riots have also been happening right since then, so let's not make it into congress propaganda by falsely making it out to be a recent thing after Babri.

second point- differences? Yeah, some differences. One side says  there should be no appeasement/ special laws for any one group. The other side considers that communal. So what's the first group to do? Try to get a secular pat on the back by bending over?

third, irrespective of whether it is politicians or whoever playing games, responsibility and accountability lies with the people who indulge in bad behavior. Shouldn't be passing the buck.

Fourth, what's wrong with someone calling themselves a Hindu Nationalist? He is Hindu. Fact. He claims he is Nationalist. So? Dont US Presidents proudly wear their religion on their sleeves, and make sure they are seen going to church every sunday morning? Wont you expect to see a Muslim leader wearing his skull-cap? Bottom-line, as long as someone does not mix their religion with state policy, there should not be any problem. Do you have a problem with someone being proud about being Hindu?Ouch

and fifth, to your earlier point about terrorists and Babri rioters being the same, there is again a big difference. The terrorists have a policy. The rioters are people who run amok in the heat of the moment. One is premeditated murder with intent, another is a crime committed in the heat of passion. As far as the latter is concerned, as long as people are humans, they will all have that failing, in whatever measure. But only one group makes it a policy instrument. The action reaction also has totally different scales in the two cases. In one case, the killings go on and on and on... Lots of reaction if you ask me.

and last i checked, most of the world over, there's a certain group that's considered more fanatical/ terrorism-prone than any other. Good try in trying to paint the BJP/ RSS in the same light, but no one is buying that cuckoo stuff.  

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enigmatic_zephy

enigmatic_zephy

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Posted: 10 September 2013 at 1:20pm | IP Logged
Originally posted by ramjaane

1. In a multicultural, multireligious society always there is some difference , so also it have unity component.  It is wrong  to think that these are byproduct of partition horror if that is so then the most volatile should be the region which not only witness but majorly suffer the partition religious horror like West Bengal or in Punjab. If we look at history than Infact west bengal have no history of riots during 1992 when India witnessed riots all over.  The point is in recent history most of the major riots were not spontaneous , instead a manufactured one where different fanatic groups use the situation for furthering their cause . Blatantly they fanning the sectarian and religious conflict among people , try to polarise the society. 


West Bengal has immense history of riots...and it doesn't help that it was a business center back then..

The entire Bangladesh region was part of Bengal.

I think Birdie has answered well..and yes, partition started in Bengal not in punjab..


2. Regarding british divide rule concept , our present generation, how we approach secularism is also interesting. A PM aspirant who want to be at the helm of the nation declare himself Hindu nationalist. We can witness many of our generation support his outlook. The way they paint the nationalism is interesting , shall a parsi declare himself as parsi nationalist, muslim declare he is muslim nationaltist, a christian as christian nationalist, like he declare he is hindu nationalist ?


he says what he feels..he doesnot mince words...What about those who go about preaching bhai bhai and then indulge in such heinous acts...

why do people conveniently forget how the entire godhra kaand started..?

I stand by what i said... sweet talking, forgiveness and so called love is not the best way of handling matters always..you need to punish people..ofcourse, the punishment preferably has to be severe as dictated by the law..I am not saying support hooliganism...but you definitely can't go on saying let's talk ...

Yes in the aim of  polarization of society certainly the divide rule product of British like RSS golwalikar  etc. declare themselves as hindu nationalist, but we never hear a  Bhagat Singh declare himself as Sikh nationalist or a chandra sekhar azad hindu nationalist or a Ashafaqulla khan as muslim nationalist or related to the thread heading surname M K Gandhi himself as hindu nationalist. 

And yet, if you read about all those round table conferences you will see how much support each extended to the other... in almost all, you will find that the muslim group was never happy..and congress/ or whatever group was there...always had to make sure that there are representatives from all front...



We never had enough faith and trust on each other to accept a true leader...we always wanted to see people from our community up there...this is a mistrust of gravest nature...you can fix the superficial things..but this undercurrent in part of the society...and explanation is not as simple as having multi ethnic groups...NO..its a lot of experiences..

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