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Bazigar

@Bazigar

IF-Dazzler

Posted: 10 years ago

Originally posted by: enigmatic_zephy

I just try to make an off topic point , is it not quite interesting that even educated class like us simply give the statement like Modi theory of action-reaction theory ? By implicitly justifying riots by blaming train burning ?

Shall we buy the same theory of terrorists who try to justify their act by blaming babri demolition , followed up riots all over India, Mumbai riots, Gujarat riots blah blah same action-reaction theory.

On topic rajiv gandhi is related to all this by igniting the Mandir-Masjid issue for his political benefit to counter then opposition , only thing is in this process he encouraged religious fanatics.

I feel religious fanaticism is just like terrorism.

Example of same action reaction theory of terrorist , only in these action reaction ping pong ordinary human lost their life who have nothing to do with the issue. A simple song

[YOUTUBE]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=7G_p2A5Dzfc[/YOUTUBE]

Edited by ramjaane - 10 years ago

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433100

Inactive

Posted: 10 years ago

Originally posted by: ramjaane

My point is aggressive tactics are sometime required...extremism has its own merits and its own horrors...not specific godhra..

Buy whatever theory..bottom line is survival...

On terrorism, as on today what r their reasons, that is much debatable...but let me argue India's stand on this because that's where I see this from...

What are we doing? Nothing...we die and go back to living our life...Why can't India take a tough stand..either u die (which u anyways are dying) or u win..but u end a major portion of issues...

But instead, we smile and get slapped each time- be it international relations or be internal security...

The problem is that no step has ever been taken...

Peace process, negotiation is indeed the first step to take..but it comes with a time limit else it is seen as weakness...actually any tactic that doesn';t deliver has no impact , has no effect..

Case in point: the decision govt had to take after kandhar..that if hijacks happen, we will have to live with collateral damage..

( Now you may argue that's worng because u let people die..but i think someone needs to take a harsh steps to put an end to it...)

Case in point: Until people start teaching rapists lessons, it is not going down because the parliament is full of rapists.

( Fear needs to be instilled..)

Aggressive tactics are required at a certain threshold,

Someone or the other will always be ready to kill you, that's us humans...I am not saying justified or not we should let someone else kill us..NO...its a fight for survival and quest to control these antisocila activities...

So if someone threatens you..defensive tactics are not always the answer..ofcourse, the grey area is how far u can go...

Riots each time have ruined millions of people..too much devastation..and hasn't India seen enough of riots since independence...

Acknowledge another fact, that we the people are responsible for it...there has always been this undercurrent of mistrust...which has been exploited time and again...

So after a time you have to give in to the 'dialog' process..and take some strict actions against people who perpetuate this...laws that are actually implemented..but that is just not happening...so what do you do when the right effective methods are not an option..you end up relying on other tactics..

There is a reason why India can't , hasn't solved any security problem till date...

On topic rajiv gandhi is related to all this by igniting the Mandir-Masjid issue for his political benefit to counter then opposition , only thing is in this process he encouraged religious fanatics.

I feel religious fanaticism is just like terrorism.

Example of same action reaction theory of terrorist , only in these action reaction ping pong ordinary human lost their life who have nothing to do with the issue. A simple song

[YOUTUBE]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=7G_p2A5Dzfc[/YOUTUBE]

no idea abt the song..can't play..but u r missing my point..its not an action/reaction theory..I am talking abt aggressive tactics..and if they are required...I think yes, sometimes they are..sometimes power of fear has more merits than power of love..

I am not supporting eye for an eye 😃 .. i am just saying at times it is required..what happened in godhra..is all of it justified..NO...it wud hv never grown into this big a problem had those people been nabbed and punished adequately...but then how do u identify them..no one cud..there are a myriad questions..and deaths are always BAD..they are..ask whoever loses his/her family members...

BUT then, as on today..shud we keep reminding ourselves abt partition..and why pakistan happened..and refuse any relationship with UK?...shud we keep reminding ourselves of '93..and kick both allah and ram out of India?...shud we forget all the bloodshed that happened prior to independence..and how calculatta and bangladesh were bleeding? and abuse the leaders of those time..or maybe the priests from each community...

Should we not burn us ourselves alive for letting these religion based crimes continue in our society..?

NO rt?.. Neither are we doing any of this..we aren't...

So if u keep living the godhra kaan every now and then..no one can move on...

Hasn't BJP come in power before..was each instance accompanied with riots? NO..

Moreover, its not that BJP is better than COngress..far from it..

But the hour of the need is...we have no hope..if congress stays in power..soon enough if they continue with such large scale corruptions..the poverty would frustrate us ( enough crime rate already)...that riots will become an obvious consequence any which way..

Edited by enigmatic_zephy - 10 years ago

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Bazigar

@Bazigar

IF-Dazzler

Posted: 10 years ago

((Don't misunderstand but why do people forget what muslims did to begin all this...

people were set to fire..the entire train incident..

Similarly, what modi did , though an aggressive step..( and obviously exponentially increased in its aftereffects)...but then the other side of the truth is..never ever wud there be riots..or have been..))

1. My response was totally based on the point of action reaction implicit justification you gave in above two points. Lets i will reply the same again: The way implicitly justify riots the same way terrorists justify their act with the action reaction theory. That previous post is based on that , not about how to tackle terrorism. Yes India shows so much loophole in its approach on terrorism of bomb simultaneous in riots . The terrorism of bomb, sword and trishul are same. I only relate the justification we try to give on riots by blaming train burning with how terrorists use the same justification. It is nothing to do with the issue of terrorism and how to handle it. Basically my whole earlier point is related to the theory of action - reaction that many try to put like riot is by blaming train burning, that example is 1992 riots followed by blast with the same justification of action reaction by those terrorists.

2. What type of fear need to be instilled ? So people burned in train , then political goons like babu bajarangi , kodani are free to burn innocent lives who have nothing to do with the incident. so who do you think teach lesson to those rapists in riots . If we apply the same logic those people murdered their relatives are free to unleash in the same way to other , the logic dangerously justify this.

3.The way u r saying fear should be instilled etc. so among whom you try to instill fear the innocent lives who have nothing to do with the issue happened just because they share the same religion ? Infact this funda of hindu fanatics only helping their counter part in muslim fanatics on the basis of ideology both are chachera - mausera bhai. Both blame each other and take innocent lives in the process.

4. This undercurrent of mistrust is slowly nurtured and fueled by political groups for their own ambition. After partition if we see history then the major riots (not small ones ) where death count is more than 1000 are pre and post babri movement in India, then again in Mumbai , then again in Gujarat. In all these three we found the main perpetrators were related to BJP/RSS/VHP and shivsena. So hear you find a religious fanatics group related to hindu , just like there were muslim fanatic groups. . This mistrust is only gradually nurtured and used by different fanatic groups.

This teach a lesson is always a preaching of both side of religion fanatics. Both want to nurture and use the insecurity among people. This teach a lesson is always there among us as an insecurity, once a friend praised Bal Thakrey in the same way that he taught a lesson to certain community , my response is he just gave the same reason of other side of fanatics and terrorists to teach a lesson. This teach a lesson of mob is not on the culprit it is always targeted towards innocent civilians who have nothing to do with the issue.

We have to learn from history rather than overlook the same ,my whole point is based on that issue , chalo i am going out of this topic😊 , if you can then enjoy a great documentary how politician exploit religion, a great detail of this vicious cycle since 1992 , where the main protagonist is non other than our Advani :

[YOUTUBE]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=UFdqadr-eyY[/YOUTUBE]

Edited by ramjaane - 10 years ago

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Bazigar

@Bazigar

IF-Dazzler

Posted: 10 years ago

[YOUTUBE]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_mo9WY53Uvs[/YOUTUBE]

The above part of a documentary brilliantly answer in a nutshell about the psychology behind the teach a lesson from the mouth of rioters themselves , involvement of all religious fanatics and why it happens.

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758054

Inactive

Posted: 10 years ago

what i feel is.. ayodhya was originally a ram mandir ! and it should have stayed that way... but politicians brought in religion..they created riots.. and we people suffered.

advani will be a good PM.. then comes modi ..rahul gandhi etc is a big no !

rajiv gandhi was a good man.. but he should not have interfered with the sri lankans and also bangladesh pakistan war!

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433100

Inactive

Posted: 10 years ago

On BJP and congress:

Worth watching video

Arvind Kejriwaal..

"Hum hi bewakoof hai ki BJP-Congress karte rehte hain..sab mile hue hai"

https://www.youtube.com/watch?feature=player_embedded&v=SnSH8v8e288

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return_to_hades

@return_to_hades

IF-Stunnerz

+ 6

Posted: 10 years ago

Originally posted by: mr.ass
^^ it seems you do not understand anything 😆 first calling modi communist and then saying you dont know what communism means! he is a hardcore capitalist.

there has not been any riots in the last 10 years in gujarat, so how anyone can even call him hitler is crazy.

After reading the post, I think there was a confusion between communal and communist.

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Bankim Chandra Chaterjee

@mr.ass

IF-Rockerz

Posted: 10 years ago

Originally posted by: return_to_hades

After reading the post, I think there was a confusion between communal and communist.

true that 😆 and the fact that there haven't been any riots for the last 11 years and the fact that hindus and muslims get along best in guj shows how "comunist" he is 😆

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433100

Inactive

Posted: 10 years ago

Originally posted by: mr.ass

true that 😆 and the fact that there haven't been any riots for the last 11 years and the fact that hindus and muslims get along best in guj shows how "comunist" he is 😆

😃

people really really need to accept the fact that no god, allah, jesus is sitting in the void of universe, and on a lookout for his 'bandas'..😆

People r so funny...do they really think on kailash, shivji stays with his family or that deep in the oceans, vishnu ji and his colony resides..adept at breathing underwater and sleeping with/on snakes..

and similarly for every other single religion..rediciulous..

aur phir ek doosre ke maarne aa jaate hain..mere bhagwaan ko kya kahan, tumhaare allah ko kya kaha..😆..aao murder murder khelein 😆

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Bazigar

@Bazigar

IF-Dazzler

Posted: 10 years ago

Exactly but , RSS/BJP fanatics cant understand this, who indulge in the this killing game in the name of religion or our pm aspirant who prefer to identify himself on the basis of religion as hindu nationalist .😆

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