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Saraswatichandra

Crisp Bytes SC - 16th aug 13 (Page 19)

hotdogg Senior Member
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Posts: 722

Posted: 17 August 2013 at 11:52pm | IP Logged
guys...

just spoke to a superior being...dear wife...who wants us to go out today and said why am  I still stuck to my laptop...and enough already types...

After I told her what we were discussing ...she's explained to me as if she was explaining to a baby...she's made a few points which I am putting down which further neatly explains VC...

She also has in her dangerously sweet look said...there I have solved your problem...now lets go!

So quickly penning this down...

 
VC - The character:
- He is a strong, active character...he still is.
- However, passivity is because VC is reeling under extreme loss of his own judgement & self-confidence.

Why?
1) First he had P's rista. He overruled this and using his judgement / trust he decided to go for saras. His reasoning was that saras is my best friend's son and this rishta is 100% on. Even when saras visited RN, he was going all jamai raja types.

2) His judgement /trust  was proved wrong that time when he came to know that saras had rejected the proposal. (#1)

3) Saras proposed again. He again used his judgement/trust and accepted the proposal. Saras behavior while in RN had revived his trust. There was a scene where there is a FB of the saras proposal, where VC says that "Mujhe tumhare pe ab aur bhi zyada bharosa hai."

4) His judgement / trust was broken again. (#2)

5) At this stage, two forces were at play
(i) when his judgement / trust was broken again...he was in uncharted territory...because all his old assessment metrics were broken...So all decisions taken in this state were instinctive.
(ii) in anger / shock / shattering of his trust, he wanted to compensate...and prove espectially to LN / saras that they were wrong in rejecting kumud...simply by getting kumud married to a still bigger family without anyone's help / pity ...all the dialogues of isse bhi bada rishta... 

6) In gujrat ...even now... I can vouch for this because me and my wife have stood on the side of some of her cousins against their parents ... in arranged marriages, people still give importance largely to the family - Is the family of good standing in society, Is the family secure financially -  with the groom whom they are getting their daughter married coming as a distant secondary... (I can personally count as I write, a few  Laurel & Hardy type jodis, often with the lady the better of the couple)... This is understable from a cultural perspective...in a tradtionally enterpreneurial trading community...

7) So VC did not even bother to inquire about Pramad...as long as his cross-checks of BD the family were getting checklisted.

8) After the wedding when news started to percolate about Pramad..and he came back to his senses...he started to feel anxious...THEN he started to find out more about the groom...

9) He kept discounting all of the above...just hoping and praying that he was right

10) Then when he saw Pramad drunk...his judgement / trust was shattered again (#3).
This was the most horrific and shattering event. He is now totally at sea.

11) A Woman's perspective here >>
-A woman can and will upfront share all her feelings / status to her mother..without leaving anything out ...which kumud did with DB.
- However, no matter how close she is to her father...she will never ever share the details unless asked persistently.
- Add to this the fact that kumud has her own reason not to share everyting with her family.

12) for VC ... 3 times of trust / judgement shattering...he is broken ...the impact is so severe that he has zero trust on his own decision making capacity...he is now totally scared about taking any decision AND applying it on Kumud...because he's shit scared that he's will screw up her life more... the dialogue where he says he now has no right to take any decision for kumud...with kumud replying that he still has the right to take decisions for him.

THIS IS WHY he is not asking kumud to stay back / react...and goes out and cries due to the utter helplessness he feels...he is all the more shattered that screwed up DB's life too!!

Kumud - The character
1) Kumud is a "Vatt No Katko"... Vatt meaning not ego & Katko meaning a piece...Vatt denotes a very high level of self-esteem / self-respect...which often is mistaken for arrogance...sort of like 'Mera Chehra Dekhe Bina Hi Naa Kaise Bol Diya!" attitude...like see me and then refuse if needed...without seeing me how can you decide!

for e.g. when saras refused the first time, any other girl would have acccepted...but this Vatt no Katko challenged saras to come and say it on her face and then refused to show him her face...If she was arrogant she would not have given him the second chance...

2) After saras rejected her the second time...NOW she wants her marriage to work... just to prove to saras that It was his loss... so each time when she is crying alone, whenever saras comes in front of her, her demeanor changes instantly...

.This is her PRIMARY reason, since she feels the rejection personally...because the 1st time when saras had rejected the proposal it was not personal ...Yet this Vatt No Katko had taken it personally till DB explained to her...even then she goes "Kis Haq se"and I can't forgive him...she helps him for DB and eventually falls for him too...

...the 2nd time he rejected her PERSONALLY..after all the mind, body, soul, PMS ...so she's hurt and feels used...so the "Meine poore hosho hawaas mein yeh kiya hain""... ...she has thought it through...it is not a hasty decision at all...more mind less heart...more like Its enough!

Emphasis>> THIS IS THE PRIMARY REASON

3)  And all that father's prestige,  sisters & Yash future...all that which is is denoting her primary reasons are actually SECONDARY.

4) For her the easy way out is to leave BD house...her father and Deasi's will be on her side anyway. Saras is ready & waiting to marry..

BUT if she agrees to return:
(i) it is a blow to her self-esteem ...sort of like thukrake shaadi ki... not due to the
Haq of her love but like second's ...

(ii) it proves her father wrong...thereby shattering his self-belief permenantly.

IF she succeeds she helps him regain his self-confidence ...his judgements do not cause harm..and so he begins to heal...and resores his confidence...also her Vatt is maintained...

5) The destiny angle is that kumud is now like If Life gives you lemons, make lemonade!

 hmm...little long...but posting it anyway...

cya later ...

Tongue


The following 6 member(s) liked the above post:

AdianismrthtwilakiranpriKK84Arshics

happychappy IF-Dazzler
happychappy
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Joined: 10 April 2013
Posts: 2524

Posted: 18 August 2013 at 12:37am | IP Logged
Originally posted by Arshics

@ Hgg, ivy 

Strange strange. Saras's wov - almost didn't happen because Saras has saraswati's tendency for suicide, and it did happen because of Saraswati, the third mother - the destroyer and protector in one! 

And it is always his replacements who pull him back - first time he would have followed her into the water, but Mai his nominated mother pulled him back

Second time from the terrace, his enforced mom pulled him back 

And third time, his love, the wife who replaces mother as the first woman in a mans life, pulls him back! 

Interesting! 

His trait of self injury, was that inherited from Saraswati, who carried it to the ultimate extreme? 

Highlight of the whole thread for me, Arshi!...Clap
You're beyond compare...out-gautaming Gautam himself..LOL 
(For those in the dark, see Arshi's fun thread!)


Originally posted by arshcs

Makes perfect sense Ivy, going to the exact spot, and taking the kasam, was a correlation with Saraswati, and anyway, who is Saras, but saraswati's son?  Right from the moment we met Saras, we have also seen a tussle about who he is. LN demands that Saras become his son, Guman claims that Saras is hers and she has moulded him to her design, Mai has her own claims on him, and Guniyal becomes ma to him. He denounced LN and Guman by choice, and Mai and Guniyal have been lost to fateHe is, was and remains saraswati's son. So if saraswati's fate is becoming Kumud's fate, he will want to change that is also right. And Kumud - her birth mothers shiksha of accepting the good and bad in the husband, has given her the aastha, her saasuma's aasha, will give her the himmat, and the third mother, represented by Saras will give the raasta. Aastha, himmat aur raasta, jab sab saath hon, toh manzil mil hi jayegi. So pramaad sudhar is bound to happen,

Once again, outstanding analysis, Star  but heart-breaking if @red happens...Ouch





Edited by happychappy - 18 August 2013 at 12:50am

The following 2 member(s) liked the above post:

kiranpriArshics

Arshics IF-Sizzlerz
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Joined: 22 February 2012
Posts: 15704

Posted: 18 August 2013 at 1:59am | IP Logged
Originally posted by hotdogg

guys...

just spoke to a superior being...dear wife...who wants us to go out today and said why am  I still stuck to my laptop...and enough already types...

After I told her what we were discussing ...she's explained to me as if she was explaining to a baby...she's made a few points which I am putting down which further neatly explains VC...

She also has in her dangerously sweet look said...there I have solved your problem...now lets go!

So quickly penning this down...

 
VC - The character:
- He is a strong, active character...he still is.
- However, passivity is because VC is reeling under extreme loss of his own judgement & self-confidence.

Why?
1) First he had P's rista. He overruled this and using his judgement / trust he decided to go for saras. His reasoning was that saras is my best friend's son and this rishta is 100% on. Even when saras visited RN, he was going all jamai raja types.

2) His judgement /trust  was proved wrong that time when he came to know that saras had rejected the proposal. (#1)

3) Saras proposed again. He again used his judgement/trust and accepted the proposal. Saras behavior while in RN had revived his trust. There was a scene where there is a FB of the saras proposal, where VC says that "Mujhe tumhare pe ab aur bhi zyada bharosa hai."

4) His judgement / trust was broken again. (#2)

5) At this stage, two forces were at play
(i) when his judgement / trust was broken again...he was in uncharted territory...because all his old assessment metrics were broken...So all decisions taken in this state were instinctive.
(ii) in anger / shock / shattering of his trust, he wanted to compensate...and prove espectially to LN / saras that they were wrong in rejecting kumud...simply by getting kumud married to a still bigger family without anyone's help / pity ...all the dialogues of isse bhi bada rishta... 

6) In gujrat ...even now... I can vouch for this because me and my wife have stood on the side of some of her cousins against their parents ... in arranged marriages, people still give importance largely to the family - Is the family of good standing in society, Is the family secure financially -  with the groom whom they are getting their daughter married coming as a distant secondary... (I can personally count as I write, a few  Laurel & Hardy type jodis, often with the lady the better of the couple)... This is understable from a cultural perspective...in a tradtionally enterpreneurial trading community...

7) So VC did not even bother to inquire about Pramad...as long as his cross-checks of BD the family were getting checklisted.

8) After the wedding when news started to percolate about Pramad..and he came back to his senses...he started to feel anxious...THEN he started to find out more about the groom...

9) He kept discounting all of the above...just hoping and praying that he was right

10) Then when he saw Pramad drunk...his judgement / trust was shattered again (#3).
This was the most horrific and shattering event. He is now totally at sea.

11) A Woman's perspective here >>
-A woman can and will upfront share all her feelings / status to her mother..without leaving anything out ...which kumud did with DB.
- However, no matter how close she is to her father...she will never ever share the details unless asked persistently.
- Add to this the fact that kumud has her own reason not to share everyting with her family.

12) for VC ... 3 times of trust / judgement shattering...he is broken ...the impact is so severe that he has zero trust on his own decision making capacity...he is now totally scared about taking any decision AND applying it on Kumud...because he's shit scared that he's will screw up her life more... the dialogue where he says he now has no right to take any decision for kumud...with kumud replying that he still has the right to take decisions for him.

THIS IS WHY he is not asking kumud to stay back / react...and goes out and cries due to the utter helplessness he feels...he is all the more shattered that screwed up DB's life too!!

Kumud - The character
1) Kumud is a "Vatt No Katko"... Vatt meaning not ego & Katko meaning a piece...Vatt denotes a very high level of self-esteem / self-respect...which often is mistaken for arrogance...sort of like 'Mera Chehra Dekhe Bina Hi Naa Kaise Bol Diya!" attitude...like see me and then refuse if needed...without seeing me how can you decide!

for e.g. when saras refused the first time, any other girl would have acccepted...but this Vatt no Katko challenged saras to come and say it on her face and then refused to show him her face...If she was arrogant she would not have given him the second chance...

2) After saras rejected her the second time...NOW she wants her marriage to work... just to prove to saras that It was his loss... so each time when she is crying alone, whenever saras comes in front of her, her demeanor changes instantly...

.This is her PRIMARY reason, since she feels the rejection personally...because the 1st time when saras had rejected the proposal it was not personal ...Yet this Vatt No Katko had taken it personally till DB explained to her...even then she goes "Kis Haq se"and I can't forgive him...she helps him for DB and eventually falls for him too...

...the 2nd time he rejected her PERSONALLY..after all the mind, body, soul, PMS ...so she's hurt and feels used...so the "Meine poore hosho hawaas mein yeh kiya hain""... ...she has thought it through...it is not a hasty decision at all...more mind less heart...more like Its enough!

Emphasis>> THIS IS THE PRIMARY REASON

3)  And all that father's prestige,  sisters & Yash future...all that which is is denoting her primary reasons are actually SECONDARY.

4) For her the easy way out is to leave BD house...her father and Deasi's will be on her side anyway. Saras is ready & waiting to marry..

BUT if she agrees to return:
(i) it is a blow to her self-esteem ...sort of like thukrake shaadi ki... not due to the
Haq of her love but like second's ...

(ii) it proves her father wrong...thereby shattering his self-belief permenantly.

IF she succeeds she helps him regain his self-confidence ...his judgements do not cause harm..and so he begins to heal...and resores his confidence...also her Vatt is maintained...

5) The destiny angle is that kumud is now like If Life gives you lemons, make lemonade!

 hmm...little long...but posting it anyway...

cya later ...

Tongue



Perfect perspective from Mrs Hgg. And Miya ser to biwi sawa ser! Please do covey our Clap for being one up on even you in her analytical skills. 

We always looked at Kumud's triple rejection for understanding her decision, but never noted VC's triple error of judgement for his ladli daughter. 

And how that must shake him up too.


Edited by Arshics - 18 August 2013 at 2:00am

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hotdoggtwilakiranpri

twila IF-Dazzler
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Joined: 08 March 2012
Posts: 4500

Posted: 18 August 2013 at 2:20am | IP Logged
Friends ...




See ... how Wonderfully you have managed to thrash out and resolve all the supposed Gonflict issues ... and put the Building Blocks in place for the future ...    Smile

That is why it is said ... not to give up to soon.        Smile 

Thanks for so much " Mind Food " ... and so much to read .       Tongue



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Posted: 18 August 2013 at 2:26am | IP Logged
Guys ...



" 1) First he had P's rista. He overruled this and using his judgement / trust he decided to go for saras.   "

This issue of Pramad's Rishtaa for Kumud having come before Saras ... i Think we have got it wrong ...

As far as i remeber ... In the intro scene of BD and his wife coming to Haveli ... VC talking later to Kumud and Gun had clearly mentioned that ... BD had come with the Rishtaa for Kumud , but by then LN had already asked for Kumud's hand for Saras , so he had said No ...

Do correct me if my memory is not serving me right .


Edited by twila - 18 August 2013 at 2:27am

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Arshics

kiranpri IF-Dazzler
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Posted: 18 August 2013 at 2:34am | IP Logged
Very interesting analysys from all aspects, has made reading the posts really enjoyable. However at the end of the day, there is a spark missing from Sraswatichandra the serial. At the moment I am more annoyed at the turn of the events and watching Saraswatichandra out of sheer support for Gautam Rode than the kumud centred track which to me is unrealistic, but maybe acceptable in India.

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twilahappychappyArshics

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Posted: 18 August 2013 at 2:37am | IP Logged
Originally posted by hotdogg

guys...

just spoke to a superior being...dear wife...who wants us to go out today and said why am  I still stuck to my laptop...and enough already types...

After I told her what we were discussing ...she's explained to me as if she was explaining to a baby...she's made a few points which I am putting down which further neatly explains VC...

She also has in her dangerously sweet look said...there I have solved your problem...now lets go!

So quickly penning this down...

 
VC - The character:
- He is a strong, active character...he still is.
- However, passivity is because VC is reeling under extreme loss of his own judgement & self-confidence.

Why?
1) First he had P's rista. He overruled this and using his judgement / trust he decided to go for saras. His reasoning was that saras is my best friend's son and this rishta is 100% on. Even when saras visited RN, he was going all jamai raja types.

2) His judgement /trust  was proved wrong that time when he came to know that saras had rejected the proposal. (#1)

3) Saras proposed again. He again used his judgement/trust and accepted the proposal. Saras behavior while in RN had revived his trust. There was a scene where there is a FB of the saras proposal, where VC says that "Mujhe tumhare pe ab aur bhi zyada bharosa hai."

4) His judgement / trust was broken again. (#2)

5) At this stage, two forces were at play
(i) when his judgement / trust was broken again...he was in uncharted territory...because all his old assessment metrics were broken...So all decisions taken in this state were instinctive.
(ii) in anger / shock / shattering of his trust, he wanted to compensate...and prove espectially to LN / saras that they were wrong in rejecting kumud...simply by getting kumud married to a still bigger family without anyone's help / pity ...all the dialogues of isse bhi bada rishta... 

6) In gujrat ...even now... I can vouch for this because me and my wife have stood on the side of some of her cousins against their parents ... in arranged marriages, people still give importance largely to the family - Is the family of good standing in society, Is the family secure financially -  with the groom whom they are getting their daughter married coming as a distant secondary... (I can personally count as I write, a few  Laurel & Hardy type jodis, often with the lady the better of the couple)... This is understable from a cultural perspective...in a tradtionally enterpreneurial trading community...

7) So VC did not even bother to inquire about Pramad...as long as his cross-checks of BD the family were getting checklisted.

8) After the wedding when news started to percolate about Pramad..and he came back to his senses...he started to feel anxious...THEN he started to find out more about the groom...

9) He kept discounting all of the above...just hoping and praying that he was right

10) Then when he saw Pramad drunk...his judgement / trust was shattered again (#3).
This was the most horrific and shattering event. He is now totally at sea.

11) A Woman's perspective here >>
-A woman can and will upfront share all her feelings / status to her mother..without leaving anything out ...which kumud did with DB.
- However, no matter how close she is to her father...she will never ever share the details unless asked persistently.
- Add to this the fact that kumud has her own reason not to share everyting with her family.

12) for VC ... 3 times of trust / judgement shattering...he is broken ...the impact is so severe that he has zero trust on his own decision making capacity...he is now totally scared about taking any decision AND applying it on Kumud...because he's shit scared that he's will screw up her life more... the dialogue where he says he now has no right to take any decision for kumud...with kumud replying that he still has the right to take decisions for him.

THIS IS WHY he is not asking kumud to stay back / react...and goes out and cries due to the utter helplessness he feels...he is all the more shattered that screwed up DB's life too!!

Kumud - The character
1) Kumud is a "Vatt No Katko"... Vatt meaning not ego & Katko meaning a piece...Vatt denotes a very high level of self-esteem / self-respect...which often is mistaken for arrogance...sort of like 'Mera Chehra Dekhe Bina Hi Naa Kaise Bol Diya!" attitude...like see me and then refuse if needed...without seeing me how can you decide!

for e.g. when saras refused the first time, any other girl would have acccepted...but this Vatt no Katko challenged saras to come and say it on her face and then refused to show him her face...If she was arrogant she would not have given him the second chance...

2) After saras rejected her the second time...NOW she wants her marriage to work... just to prove to saras that It was his loss... so each time when she is crying alone, whenever saras comes in front of her, her demeanor changes instantly...

.This is her PRIMARY reason, since she feels the rejection personally...because the 1st time when saras had rejected the proposal it was not personal ...Yet this Vatt No Katko had taken it personally till DB explained to her...even then she goes "Kis Haq se"and I can't forgive him...she helps him for DB and eventually falls for him too...

...the 2nd time he rejected her PERSONALLY..after all the mind, body, soul, PMS ...so she's hurt and feels used...so the "Meine poore hosho hawaas mein yeh kiya hain""... ...she has thought it through...it is not a hasty decision at all...more mind less heart...more like Its enough!

Emphasis>> THIS IS THE PRIMARY REASON

3)  And all that father's prestige,  sisters & Yash future...all that which is is denoting her primary reasons are actually SECONDARY.

4) For her the easy way out is to leave BD house...her father and Deasi's will be on her side anyway. Saras is ready & waiting to marry..

BUT if she agrees to return:
(i) it is a blow to her self-esteem ...sort of like thukrake shaadi ki... not due to the
Haq of her love but like second's ...

(ii) it proves her father wrong...thereby shattering his self-belief permenantly.

IF she succeeds she helps him regain his self-confidence ...his judgements do not cause harm..and so he begins to heal...and resores his confidence...also her Vatt is maintained...

5) The destiny angle is that kumud is now like If Life gives you lemons, make lemonade!

 hmm...little long...but posting it anyway...

cya later ...

Tongue






Hgg Bhaaii ...



What Accurate reading ... and so Clear and To the point ... everything explained so Beautifully ... with all the Social and Cultural contexts .

Please Convey our Heartiest Appreciation and Thanks to your wife  ...     Clap


and Please accept that she is one step ahead ...       Big smile



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hotdogg

Arshics IF-Sizzlerz
Arshics
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Joined: 22 February 2012
Posts: 15704

Posted: 18 August 2013 at 2:39am | IP Logged
Originally posted by twila

Guys ...



" 1) First he had P's rista. He overruled this and using his judgement / trust he decided to go for saras.   "

This issue of Pramad's Rishtaa for Kumud having come before Saras ... i Think we have got it wrong ...

As far as i remeber ... In the intro scene of BD and his wife coming to Haveli ... VC talking later to Kumud and Gun had clearly mentioned that ... BD had come with the Rishtaa for Kumud , but by then LN had already asked for Kumud's hand for Saras , so he had said No ...

Do correct me if my memory is not serving me right .

You are right Twila, but to be able to connect the dots, again to look beyond the scenes and figure out the motives of the characters was missing. It took time, thanks to my own limitations! 

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twila

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