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-Aarya-

Goldie

-Aarya-

Joined: 02 November 2010

Posts: 1613

Posted: 01 March 2013 at 2:19pm | IP Logged
Originally posted by TheTruth

Originally posted by -Aarya-


I have always believed that people learn to be women and men vs what they are born as! We tend to confuse sex with gender, while sex is your biological and physiological characteristic which defines a person from male to female vs gender is where society sets the rules to your behavior. If such rules weren't set would we have been different people all together?





I do not necessarily agree there. There may be some truth to it though. I personally do not believe that each gender is supposed to behave certain way or do certain kinds of jobs. After all, we have women who pretty much wear everything that men wear (and more). We have stay at home dads too these days.
Though your question is hypothetical, think about it. That is how it all started at point zero. Why do you think it would be any different if we start all over again? Society will be formed (we are social animals after all) and based on the genetics and inherent different inner urges, men and women will again end up with differences. So, yes, gender defines a lot of stuff for a person. Lot of other things are social and those things (stereotypes) are dying.


It's not about starting over, but rather changing your current thought process! Ok, let me simplify by asking what does it mean to be a woman or man? Why are men always stereotyped as masculine and not feminine?


Edited by -Aarya- - 01 March 2013 at 3:32pm

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LovelyPlanet

Goldie

LovelyPlanet

Joined: 03 October 2009

Posts: 1854

Posted: 01 March 2013 at 3:21pm | IP Logged
Originally posted by King-Anu

You sure have increased the viewership of this topic by 20-30% by using the word "sex" instead of "gender". lol
 
@ topic. To be honest I am not clear on the question. The word gender is used in social and culture context while word sex reflects physical attributes. I identify to my gender however not satisfied by gender role i.e. expression of gender identity. To me that is more important.
 
I hope someone with more knowledge on this topic and who understood the question will be able to give a more appropriate and relevant answer.  
 
Let me present to you a case of confused gender identity. lol. sorry couldnt resist
 
I wrote to vintu he's funniest on IF...now torn between you and him LOL

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-Aarya-

LovelyPlanet

Goldie

LovelyPlanet

Joined: 03 October 2009

Posts: 1854

Posted: 01 March 2013 at 3:40pm | IP Logged
let me try same question differently which should be easier to answer.
 
Lets say we are given a choice to be reborn as male or female.. what would you choose and why?
 
my answer would be I am female in this life and would want to be reborn as female..
reasons being(sorry its going to sound like a bit beauty pageant contest, but men may have more interesting answer)
  women experience more in life(childbirth , emotions)
  woman are special gender, we get to choose(not always but generally)
  live longer, better health
  non violent
  can multitask
  better memories
  understand love better
 
will add more as I remember...
thoughts?
 

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-Aarya-

LovelyPlanet

Goldie

LovelyPlanet

Joined: 03 October 2009

Posts: 1854

Posted: 01 March 2013 at 4:41pm | IP Logged
Originally posted by TheTruth

Originally posted by lonely0planet

let me try same question differently which should be easier to answer.
 
Lets say we are given a choice to be reborn as male or female.. what would you choose and why?
 
my answer would be I am female in this life and would want to be reborn as female..
reasons being(sorry its going to sound like a bit beauty pageant contest, but men may have more interesting answer)
  women experience more in life(childbirth , emotions)
  woman are special gender, we get to choose(not always but generally)
  live longer, better health
  non violent
  can multitask
  better memories
  understand love better
 
will add more as I remember...
thoughts?
 

Male. Can't imagine to sit and pee.
LOL you win a point .. men are defo funnier you just proved above.. women are so edgy...

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epiphany.

IF-Sizzlerz

epiphany.

Joined: 01 July 2010

Posts: 19960

Posted: 01 March 2013 at 10:05pm | IP Logged
Originally posted by -Aarya-

Originally posted by epiphany.

Originally posted by -Aarya-

Let me clarify my question with some details...

Why is person's gender (sex) identity (male/female/others) so important to people?

A person's gender identity is not important to people. They only like talking about it scandalously. Stern Smile


How important is our gender identity?  

It is greatly important for all those who ever feel confused or anxious about it. For them, figuring out their true gender is tough but highly essential. Suddenly the whole person that they are and what they think of themselves depend on their undiscovered gender identity. Acceptance is vital here.

So does it mean that if you thought the person you were dealing with was a man and now the person's identity is known to be a woman, your perception of the person changes? And why is that?

Yes, your perception of the person changes. The perception of the person himself will change in this case, wouldn't it? I wouldn't be judgmental in my opinion of them. I would just know they need to be treated a certain way now. A person realizing all this about themselves would need support and I would not be able to provide it if I still consider them a man because that I would not have a reason to help them through anyway. You understand? Approve

Is gender really an expression of one's essential self?

Yes, I think it is. I had read an article once which stated that men and women's brain are designed very differently and that they are bound to have unlikely thoughts and actions. While a person's gender is who they think they are and want to be, their sex is what they were born with. So, their sex is an expression of their essential self because their biological characteristics are such. Albeit it is unhealthy to base everything you are about on your gender/sex. So, it can be said that gender is one of the expressions of a person's essential self, but not the only expression. 

Shouldn't the person be a human first, then  biased towards his or her gender? How difference are man's expressions vs woman's expressions? In essential don't we all have same expression regardless of our gender?

Of course the person should be human first and never biased towards his or her gender. By that what I mean is that a person must accept their gender and also the fact that every gender deserves to be treated equally because on the basic level, we're human before anything. That way we'd all know that we dun make gender-based distinctions such that they exploit people, but simply to provide every individual some clarity about who they are.

A man's expressions are quite different from a woman's. Let's all study our parents as individuals for a day and we'd know. Ermm

Regardless of gender, we have humanity. We hurt alike and bleed alike and feel angry about the same issues that have made our societies haywire. Men and women are different species of human, is all. Down at the root of it all, they are the same. But evolution has brought the two kinds to perceive things differently, react to them in their own ways and also to have distinguished, sometimes contradicting ideas.



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nishabee-Aarya-

Vinzy

IF-Stunnerz

Vinzy

Joined: 03 December 2005

Posts: 26812

Posted: 02 March 2013 at 12:08am | IP Logged
Originally posted by -Aarya-

How important is the identity of your gender? --      Some ppl stole identity...bt its okay though, they gave it back when their kids called him daddy..

I am talking about gender, the mental aspect, not sex as the physical aspect! 
 
 
Gender doenst matter bt ppl need to control their wh**emones!

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moomin4455

IF-Dazzler

moomin4455

Joined: 08 March 2012

Posts: 4211

Posted: 02 March 2013 at 10:40pm | IP Logged
Originally posted by -Aarya-

Let me clarify my question with some details...

Why is person's gender (sex) identity (male/female/others) so important to people? How important is our gender identity?  Is gender really an expression of one's essential self?


Society makes gender an essential part: our perceptions and responses are tailored towards either gender from a very early age. We expect men and women or girls and boys to behave, dress, even think, in particular ways. Look at how society at large still treats individuals that do not fall into the neat categories that we have imposed on individuals from birth: transvestites and transexuals, for example. Even homosexuals.

I also think this applies to online fora/social networking sites: we still like to know if we're communicating with a male or female so that we have an idea of what to expect. I guess one could say society uses gender as a means of filtering and imposing as well as gleaning identity at the two major levels.

Is gender really an expression of one's essential self: yes in a way because we live in a world where it has become essential. Do I believe it is essential: personally no. I like to look beyond gender to the individual.


Edited by moomin4455 - 02 March 2013 at 10:40pm

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nishabee-Aarya-

--arti--

Goldie

--arti--

Kasturi, RKS Banner Contest Winner

Joined: 20 June 2008

Posts: 1670

Posted: 03 March 2013 at 6:14am | IP Logged
Yes, gender identity is really important socially. We are constantly being "gendered" right from infancy, and sometimes even while in the womb. But gendering is a social process, which means that it is learned behaviour that responds to systems of thought and cultural practices all around us.

Biologically speaking, sex is a huge spectrum. Most people who study it medically would tell us that there are a range of physiological as well as biological characteristics that are in between what is technically classified as female and what is technically classified as male.

Some feminist theorists (e.g. Judith Butler) have argued that gender behaviour is so important socially, and that we are so emotionally committed to the supposed binary nature of gender, that we have mapped learned gender characteristics (our gendered behaviour) onto biology. So her argument is that we map gender onto sex, just so that we can believe that sex is binary. It's an argument that has merit, especially because biological data does back that up, as I mentioned above. Most biological data that explains behaviour through purely genetic data is fairly flimsy and a lot of questions remain about why that kind of research is important.

(I won't comment here on the "gene industry" and what kind of research fund motivates that kind of research - there is an awesome book out there called Biology as Ideology by Richard Lewontin which lays out a compelling argument, backed by empirical data, about how ideology and societal forces - such as capitalism - influences "cold, hard" scientific facts that we believe to be based on unbiased truths).

Then the question remains about how and why we stick our learned gendered traits. The answer to that, according to Butler, is that we perform gender all the time in response to the world, kind of like drag to take an extreme example. It is part of our social existence. Some other feminist theorists have taken some issue with that, saying that Butler's arguments about performativity make it seem like gender is a choice, and it is a lot more complicated than that. Words like gendered and gendering draw attention to the fact that these are social processes, and we don't have a choice, as an individual, to necessarily resist social processes that occur to us/through us.

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