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Is it OK to be a wife beater? (Page 6)

TheBoss IF-Dazzler
TheBoss
TheBoss

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Posted: 30 January 2013 at 12:51pm | IP Logged
Originally posted by --arti--

Actually no, because your response to my response is to say that I must be weak or drinking the kool-aid. You get that that's disrespectful, right? You have no idea about my own life experience or what kind of work against domestic violence I might be involved in. Does it occur to you that maybe you are wrong about some things? That your view on this issue isn't as evolved as you think it is?

Well you offered justifications of why its allright to put up with this and that under so and so condition. 

On the other hand I offered solutions that is you can only push somebody so far till they start pushing back, and not doing something about the problem and rolling over is not the way to go in my opinion.

If that is what you are doing in your fight against domestic violence by preaching them to hold on and stay strong then sorry but its a flawed analogy. As I said before its never OK in any situation to let others have their way with you regardless of circumstances. I have personally seen a few close ones who took a stand and fortunately they are far better off now than what they were back then being a door mat.
--arti-- Goldie
--arti--
--arti--

Kasturi, RKS Banner Contest Winner
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Posted: 30 January 2013 at 1:01pm | IP Logged
Sorry, there are no blanket solutions to domestic violence. If the world was black and white, then it would be a lot easier.

There are different kinds of violence in relationships, and depending on the resources available to a woman, and depending on what alternatives she has access to, she might make choices that you don't agree with. Your anecdotal evidence or whether or not you agree is actually frankly irrelevant.

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TheBoss

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Posted: 30 January 2013 at 1:12pm | IP Logged
So there are different kinds of violence and depending on resource one may go about dealing with them? But where do we draw the line then?

I agree there is no blanket solutions to domestic violence, neither are the band-aid solutions that you are championing to an issue that cannot be justified or accepted.

Relationships should be on the equal playing field based on mutual respect and goodness to each other if its not happening then believing in hope and holding on is a battle with your own self living in denial.

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return_to_hades

--arti-- Goldie
--arti--
--arti--

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Posted: 30 January 2013 at 1:20pm | IP Logged
If you think I have championed any band-aid solutions or that I am an apologist for violence against women of any kind, you have serious reading comprehension issues.

And nobody here disagrees that relationships should be based on mutual respect blah blah blah, etc.

The disagreement is over your self-righteous invoking of black and white stereotypes to talk about an issue so complex, so violent, and so painful. It was also over the crass and tasteless use of weak and watered down satire to make a very obvious point. And now there is no discussion anymore, because your self-victimization prevents you from seeing the points I have made, so you'd rather just write me off altogether as someone who supports injustice.

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BirdieNumNumTheBoss

return_to_hades IF-Veteran Member
return_to_hades
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Posted: 30 January 2013 at 1:28pm | IP Logged
^^

You both are on the same side of the issue, just a radically different approach to it. Rather than dismiss each other, it may be better to find a common ground or amicable reconciliation. Issues like rape, abuse, violence, trafficking are not black and white or easy. They need different perspectives to work together to find solutions. If each goes their own way, upset at the approach of the other – we'll keep spinning in circles.


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TheBoss

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Posted: 30 January 2013 at 1:28pm | IP Logged
Well Im sorry but Im reading your posts and it is confusing, you are going all over the place and I have hard time figuring out where you stand.

First you tried to accused me as a white man idealist somebody with no idea about root issues in India, I addressed to that, then you accused me of being a  feminist, I addressed you to that, then you accused me of not understanding the issue being ill informed, I addressed to that and so on. 

What is so complex about domestic violence? Why is it so hard for you to understand that it is NEVER ok to emotionally or physically harm your partner and there is NO justification for that.

It IS a black and white issue its quite simple. Confused
TheBoss IF-Dazzler
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Posted: 30 January 2013 at 1:39pm | IP Logged
Originally posted by return_to_hades

^^

You both are on the same side of the issue, just a radically different approach to it. Rather than dismiss each other, it may be better to find a common ground or amicable reconciliation. Issues like rape, abuse, violence, trafficking are not black and white or easy. They need different perspectives to work together to find solutions. If each goes their own way, upset at the approach of the other ' we'll keep spinning in circles.



We are just debating atleast Im. Embarrassed
I already said we are just having two different approaches to this issue, but my issue was that instead of offering solutions all she tried to do with one post and another is question my motives, interests, qualifications etc.

Everytime Im raising this issue she somehow thinks this is anti india or anti desi so goes on the offensive and brings in other issues from the west which has no bearing to this topic at all. Besides you me and everyone know that not everything is all in well, you open any news paper and you read about these things happening way to much way to often to call it as generalization.

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return_to_hades

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Posted: 30 January 2013 at 2:01pm | IP Logged
Originally posted by TheBoss

Originally posted by return_to_hades

^^

You both are on the same side of the issue, just a radically different approach to it. Rather than dismiss each other, it may be better to find a common ground or amicable reconciliation. Issues like rape, abuse, violence, trafficking are not black and white or easy. They need different perspectives to work together to find solutions. If each goes their own way, upset at the approach of the other ' we'll keep spinning in circles.



We are just debating atleast Im. Embarrassed
I already said we are just having two different approaches to this issue, but my issue was that instead of offering solutions all she tried to do with one post and another is question my motives, interests, qualifications etc.

Everytime Im raising this issue she somehow thinks this is anti india or anti desi so goes on the offensive and brings in other issues from the west which has no bearing to this topic at all. Besides you me and everyone know that not everything is all in well, you open any news paper and you read about these things happening way to much way to often to call it as generalization.


 

If I understand  correctly ( I could be wrong) the bones of contention she has with you are

 

-          You accused women of being stupid or suffering Stockholm syndrome for not leaving abusive relationships. This is a quite common misconception and is a major sore spot for victims and those who have worked with victims. For the longest time I used to think the same as well – I don't let anyone even talk balk to me let alone beat, have some self respect, just leave. Upon growing older and seeing women in society, I understood that it is easier said than done. There are many factors make leaving an abusive relationship a complex and difficult issue. From what I understand the worst most demeaning thing to tell an abuse victim is "Why don't you just leave?"Each case of abusive relationship is unique and the conversation starter should be "What is going on here and what is the best way to go about helping the victim"

-          You seemed to state that this was only an "Indian issue". A lot of people from the west tend to view only India. Middle East or similar developing nations as the only places that have misogynist abusive cultures. That is an offensive and hurtful stereotype, and another hot button issue. The truth is that it is a global issue. The only difference tends to be how society views women's right and abuse.

-          You also want to try to retrofit the western approach to abuse to India. The problem is that each society and culture is so different that one size fits all solutions tend to make matters worse. The problem is that many men haven't even been taught how to treat women and what constitutes abuse. Society doesn't understand the need for a woman to leave such relationships. Before we even tackle abuse, we have the daunting task of addressing these hurdles.

 

You may mean the best, but these opinions sometimes come off as brazen or unfair.


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TheBoss

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