R.I.P our martyrs - Page 22

Originally posted by: sharpshooter

I'm afraid silverbug that the BJP Government wasn't any better..remember Atal Behari Vajpayee started the bus diplomacy and Kargil happened immediately after that...maybe the only hope we have is someone like Modi...the rest of BJP seems equally bad.

Originally posted by: silverbug

My point is - Yes BJP is bad but you rather have Congress in power ? How has that worked out for us so far ? Let's try something different then.

Bus diplomacy is useless I agree, lets stop beating around the bush.

Atal was in his 70s when he became the leader, that's another problem. We only put those in power that are senile. But Atal was still more of a leader than Manmohan is, that's for sure.

I can't really back Modi, I have reservations about his role in Gujurat riolts. I have heard accounts from Gujuratis themselves which makes me uncomfortable.

India doesn't have a Hindu/Muslim problem. It has a class problem. It has to do with far too few having much too much and way too many having much too little. The ones who have little are turning into depraved monsters like Naxalites and terrorists across the country. Sometimes I find it hard to blame them, with the way things are why do we expect a different outcome ?

Originally posted by: Skepblun

It's shameful that India is being soft on such matters. Harsh and strong action has to be taken. We can't just allow ourselves to be sitting ducks here.

Public outcry is also necessary to put more pressure on government. The masses remain indifferent to such issues and government's lax approach thrives on their ignorance.

People must give government its just desserts in election time.

RIP to martyrs and condolences to their families. It must be seen that families of martyred soldiers are rehabilitated properly.

Originally posted by: TheBoss

Dude,

War is not the only thing that made the US what they are; their technology, their economy, their welfare, their education, abolishment of slavery, discrimination, addressing health issues, and a wide plethora of other things is what made the US what it is.

I love living my American dream and Im proud of it, until India steps up and addresses the pressing issues at hand instead of fighting over some stupid piece of land and sending people to death there is a whole lot that needs to be done.

You're appallingly ignorant and uneducated. Go and spend some time studying the history of the Kashmir Conflict. India has a legitimate and historical claim over the land; it isn't a "stupid war over a stupid piece of land". It has a very complex bearing on the question of Indian sovereignty and National respect. And honey, there's no bogeyman----I expect you to be educated about the TWO times India was attacked over Kashmir by Pakistan, AND the unnamed millions of civilians that have been murdered in Kashmir and elsewhere in India by cross-border infiltrators since time immemorial. These are flesh-and-blood realties, not some conspiracy theory or "bogeyman" with no base in reality that you wax ignorant about. And did you say that what the soldiers do doesn't touch our lives in any way? Are you serious?

This ain't the United States where you can bring up the "bogeyman factor" in a Debate, this is INDIA, with a very different history and political circumstance than the US and its wars. India is facing a proxy war with its neighbouring state which has nurtured fanatical religious elements that have killed more than a billion Indians since 1950. That isn't a bogeyman, that's a real issue we face everyday; unlike the US which has only been the aggressor toward States that refused to pander to its economic interests. How can you wave the "bogeyman" here? You need to come out from your constricted, cocooned world-view---US ain't the WHOLE WORLD.

Tip: Next time you come over to debate on something, make sure you KNOW what you're going on about.

Originally posted by: sharpshooter

But wasn't Rajiv Gandhi the Prime Minister when he and the Congress encouraged anti-Sikh riots? I think no leader in modern India has the ability to turn this around like Modi does..despite all the negative publicity that he receives for the Gujarat riots, he has manged to tremendously improve infrastructure in the State...Gujarat has more or less become a success story..

Originally posted by: krystal_watz

You're appallingly ignorant and uneducated. Go and spend some time studying the history of the Kashmir Conflict. India has a legitimate and historical claim over the land; it isn't a "stupid war over a stupid piece of land". It has a very complex bearing on the question of Indian sovereignty and National respect. And honey, there's no bogeyman----I expect you to be educated about the TWO times India was attacked over Kashmir by Pakistan, AND the unnamed millions of civilians that have been murdered in Kashmir and elsewhere in India by cross-border infiltrators since time immemorial. These are flesh-and-blood realties, not some conspiracy theory or "bogeyman" with no base in reality that you wax ignorant about. And did you say that what the soldiers do doesn't touch our lives in any way? Are you serious?

This ain't the United States where you can bring up the "bogeyman factor" in a Debate, this is INDIA, with a very different history and political circumstance than the US and its wars. India is facing a proxy war with its neighbouring state which has nurtured fanatical religious elements that have killed more than a billion Indians since 1950. That isn't a bogeyman, that's a real issue we face everyday; unlike the US which has only been the aggressor toward States that refused to pander to its economic interests. How can you wave the "bogeyman" here? You need to come out from your constricted, cocooned world-view---US ain't the WHOLE WORLD.

Tip: Next time you come over to debate on something, make sure you KNOW what you're going on about.

Originally posted by: silverbug

Yes, what Rajiv and his Mother did to Sikhs was wrong but does that justify Narendra Modi's role in Gujurat ? I meet some Gujuratis over here in states who often tell me with pride what rioters did and how Modi gave them full liberty. I usually just nod my head and go away because it disgusts me. I'm a Hindu myself but I've been in situations where I wascorneredand attacked in India because of myethnicity. It's not a good feeling when you are in the minority and cornered like that. Try stepping into their shoes and you will see why. As far as Gujarat becoming a success story, a lot of economists are claiming that its a farce. It's well behind states like Punjab, Haryana, Maharashtra in many aspects.

The opinions that some of the Hindu right wingers have scares me to be honest. It has scares as much as the right wing Muslims and pseudo secular Congressis. You have school drop outs like Baba Ramdev lecturing people about Homosexuality, Economics andunfoundedclaims like Yoga cures AIDS. They might be nationalists but so was Hitler.

Trust me, I'm no pseudo secular congressi bollywood bulls*itter but I'm not a right wing nutcase Hindutvadi either. I don't want any part of this left wing / right wing and Hindu / secular debate. I just want rational, educated people to rule the country.

Originally posted by: krystal_watz

^^I'm not an American.