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Lying about virginity (Page 3)

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Minnie

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Minnie

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Posted: 09 July 2006 at 7:24pm | IP Logged
I think that if the guy specifically asked about the question, then it seems, personally it matters to him a lot.

For one moment, lets not get into the debate of whether being a virgin is 'right' or 'wrong'..that's another issue altogether.

This all about being honest with another person, specially someone whom the girl is going to settle down with.

Now, for whatever reason, that this guy asked this girl, he expected an honest answer,without having a clue as to how to dea with it. However, the truth is, very few girls have the courage to speak out the truth,the reason being that once she tells him, it immediately spreads like a wildfire. The chances are, not only the guy would break the marriage, he would also tell the reason to all...and then the things would come back and carry on from there. The girl would be labelled loose character, and chances are, she would never get married, at least not in the 'arranged way'. Obviously she still lives in a society where lot of weightage is given on marriage. Once such a thing is out, not only she would face the ire, but her whole family would suffer from the shame of it. We can cry hoarse at the double standards of it all, the unfairness, the rediculous weightage still placed on the 'virginity' factor, but the truth is, her life just might become intolerable.we can keep screaming till our face is blue that it's not fair and shud not happen, but it's going to help nothing.

That is the reason she choose to lie, because there is not only her honour,but the honour of her whole family,depending on her one yes or no. And perhapd even her sisters or cousins, sometimes extending to friends even.

Because if the guy asked, it did mean that unless she was a virgin, he would say no. And carry tales.

Wrong? yes.It does make her a hypocrite, who can't live by the rules she made for herself, or rather broke for her pleasure or convinience.

But right for this particular circumstance? yes.

As for HIV.....well, the guy could be carrying it too. As someone said, how can one really be sure he is telling the truth??

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sonali_k

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sonali_k

Joined: 08 July 2006

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Posted: 09 July 2006 at 9:44pm | IP Logged
Aparna and Minnie,
The issue here is not about virginity but about lying. This is the same girl who used to flaunt her bf and their sexescapes in the hostel. That time she did not have a care in the world. Then she dumped that bf b/c he was not "rich enough" for her family. Of course she did not tell her family that she slept with him. When she started working, she had another fling but apparently that guy also was not rich enough for her. Now this guy who her parents have found is well educated, rich, good looking. Someone any girl would like to marry. Plus he is also a virgin. So now she is changing colors like a chameleon and lying to him that she is a virgin. Basically she is someone who has no ethics and morals.
And aparna, before you call girls who are virgins "hypocrites", I want to clarify again that I have nothing against pre-marital sex. If you cannot control your urges before marriage, sure go ahead and do it. But then atleast have the guts to admit it to whosoever you plan to marry. Dont cheat some innocent person and lie to him.

mkzara

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Posted: 09 July 2006 at 10:16pm | IP Logged

Originally posted by Minnie

I think that if the guy specifically asked about the question, then it seems, personally it matters to him a lot.

For one moment, lets not get into the debate of whether being a virgin is 'right' or 'wrong'..that's another issue altogether.

This all about being honest with another person, specially someone whom the girl is going to settle down with.

Now, for whatever reason, that this guy asked this girl, he expected an honest answer,without having a clue as to how to dea with it. However, the truth is, very few girls have the courage to speak out the truth,the reason being that once she tells him, it immediately spreads like a wildfire. The chances are, not only the guy would break the marriage, he would also tell the reason to all...and then the things would come back and carry on from there. The girl would be labelled loose character, and chances are, she would never get married, at least not in the 'arranged way'. Obviously she still lives in a society where lot of weightage is given on marriage. Once such a thing is out, not only she would face the ire, but her whole family would suffer from the shame of it. We can cry hoarse at the double standards of it all, the unfairness, the rediculous weightage still placed on the 'virginity' factor, but the truth is, her life just might become intolerable.we can keep screaming till our face is blue that it's not fair and shud not happen, but it's going to help nothing.

That is the reason she choose to lie, because there is not only her honour,but the honour of her whole family,depending on her one yes or no. And perhapd even her sisters or cousins, sometimes extending to friends even.

Because if the guy asked, it did mean that unless she was a virgin, he would say no. And carry tales.

Wrong? yes.It does make her a hypocrite, who can't live by the rules she made for herself, or rather broke for her pleasure or convinience.

But right for this particular circumstance? yes.

As for HIV.....well, the guy could be carrying it too. As someone said, how can one really be sure he is telling the truth??

first of allClapClapClap

second of all i completely agree with minnie, while it was possibly the hypocritical thing to do it was the right thing to do, because society and culture place so many undue burdens and restrictions upon women that even women who have the courage to break the mold are afraid to admit it, because they are not only affected but their families r affected. for all we know this guy is not a virgin, he cud be a himbo(male bimbo) or a man-whore and he just accepts chastity from his wife like so many (not all) of the hypocritical desi guys there r. this guy cud be really promiscuous and he cud just want a virgin wife cause he is conservative like that. This wud reflect the the double standard there is because he cud admit, oh i had a sexual relationship with my past gf and everyone wud be like "its not preferred but its ok" but watch the girl say it and she'll have loose character and loose morals and she'll be unmarriageable. so while she lied it was the smart thing to do, and perhaps the only thing if she didnt want to ruin her life and her parents' life.

I also agree with aparna that being a virgin does not put u on a higher moral ground than anyone else. Yeah u waited, but it was ur perrogative and that does not make u any less than u r but it also doesnt make u any more than u r. virginity is not the sole test of someone's morals and character, and having a hymen shud definitely not be the test that u have to pass to show ur virtues.



Edited by mkzara - 09 July 2006 at 10:19pm

insouciance

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insouciance

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Posted: 10 July 2006 at 6:37am | IP Logged

Originally posted by sonali_k

 

Aparna and Minnie,
The issue here is not about virginity but about lying. This is the same girl who used to flaunt her bf and their sexescapes in the hostel. That time she did not have a care in the world. Then she dumped that bf b/c he was not "rich enough" for her family. Of course she did not tell her family that she slept with him. When she started working, she had another fling but apparently that guy also was not rich enough for her. Now this guy who her parents have found is well educated, rich, good looking. Someone any girl would like to marry. Plus he is also a virgin. So now she is changing colors like a chameleon and lying to him that she is a virgin. Basically she is someone who has no ethics and morals.
And aparna, before you call girls who are virgins "hypocrites", I want to clarify again that I have nothing against pre-marital sex. If you cannot control your urges before marriage, sure go ahead and do it. But then atleast have the guts to admit it to whosoever you plan to marry. Dont cheat some innocent person and lie to him.

I agree with youBig smile

Isnt feigning to be a virgin just to save one's skin and one's family honour and  thus misleading an innocent man wrong???I mean,when the man is so particular that his wife must be a virgin,and when he has mustered the guts to ask a girl  whom he had not known from adams till a few days back a very personal question,isnt he entitled to get a truthful answer ... Why must he become a victim of perfidy for no fault of his??

As I said,there are many men who do not attach any importance to virginity(such men wouldnt ask any questions in the first place),as they themselves have sown their wild oats and been promiscuous...A girl can as well reject the proposal,citing some other reason..and if her parents are too inflexible and unbending,or too cold fashioned and conservative and if the girl is not at the liberty to reject a proposal,then she should have taken cognizance of the fact that her parents are orthodox before consummating..How impregnable and sound is a relationship, which is built on a  downright mendacious  lie going to be?If by any chance(well, take the example of sonali's friend..) the groom ,scrutinizes the girl's character,and  enquires about her to her ex-friends,and if they divulge that she has has a very active sex life earlier,wouldnt it be all the more disastrous... ..How can we say that lying is irreproachable,its not only her life,but its another person's life too

Originally posted by mkzara

second of all i completely agree with minnie, while it was possibly the hypocritical thing to do it was the right thing to do, because society and culture place so many undue burdens and restrictions upon women that even women who have the courage to break the mold are afraid to admit it, because they are not only affected but their families r affected. for all we know this guy is not a virgin, he cud be a himbo(male bimbo) or a man-whore and he just accepts chastity from his wife like so many (not all) of the hypocritical desi guys there r. this guy cud be really promiscuous and he cud just want a virgin wife cause he is conservative like that. This wud reflect the the double standard there is because he cud admit, oh i had a sexual relationship with my past gf and everyone wud be like "its not preferred but its ok" but watch the girl say it and she'll have loose character and loose morals and she'll be unmarriageable. so while she lied it was the smart thing to do, and perhaps the only thing if she didnt want to ruin her life and her parents' life.



Well, if the girl has the necessary courage to sleep with her boyfriend,very well knowing what risk it entails,she must be prepared to face the conceivable ensuing troubles..If she's so worried about her family's honour etc,she shouldnt have the taken the plunge in the first place.... and if she has,she has to face the repercussions with fortitude and moxie,rather than chickening out and lying a multitude of times to save herself from being berated and lambasted…a small mistake can prove to be the  Achilles heel and can wreak havoc in her life..Not saying that it happens to everyone,but it can happen

When my aunt was looking out for a marriage proposal for my cousin sister,she had signed up a detective(LOL ..cant believe it????FYI,there are detective agencies which are in existence only to enquire about the boys who have sent their proposal/horoscopes to girls and vice versa..They do a unbelievable job of digging out every minute detail about the boy,and the boy and his family not having a clue Big smileClapLOL)..and there were many times that they reported saying that the boy wasnt of unquestionable moral rectitude or that the boy is a chain smoker etcetera...so the whole point that a man can hide his mistakes isnt really true....you might say,how many really engage a detective and stuff,but it is quite possible Big smile

Most of the village folk,the lower middle class and the poor dont ask such questions..its only the well to do and educated who question about virginity and stuff...so when they actually have questioned,they can also engage this detective WinkLOL...


Originally posted by mkzara

I also agree with aparna that being a virgin does not put u on a higher moral ground than anyone else. Yeah u waited, but it was ur perrogative and that does not make u any less than u r but it also doesnt make u any more than u r. virginity is not the sole test of someone's morals and character, and having a hymen shud definitely not be the test that u have to pass to show ur virtues.



THIS whole virginity issue is a very subjective one....YES,its every girl's prerogative,but there are some who want to save their virginity till their marriage,and atleast I think that they must be applauded,because they have had the will power and the self restraint to hold back....Saying that abstention from sex till marriage has no importance and its the individual's character which matters talks alot about the escapist tendency.......Some comparisons are really very ludicrous,like comparing a non-virgin to a knave and saying that she didnt do what the knave did,and thus she's a good human being....I mean,compare a girl who has an active sexual life with her BF,much against the wishes of her parents and society,and a girl who has just had a platonic relationship with her BF,abstaining from sex and devoid of all sexual proclivities..a better analogy could be drawn with a smoker..he/she definitely wouldnt become a bad person,but he/she has a weakness and isnt really strong willed,it's a foible.....similarly,comparing a teetotaller to a drunkard..The society doesnt really respect a dipsomaniac..he might be a first rate man,yet its just but obvious that people who dont know him in and out take him at face value .... the tissue certainly does not speak about one's goodness,but it speaks volumes about one's virtues,ones strong adherence to the beliefs,and one's self control ,will power and determination...

 



Edited by Buffie - 10 July 2006 at 6:47am

insouciance

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insouciance

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Posted: 10 July 2006 at 7:07am | IP Logged

Originally posted by Aparna_BD


What makes a virgin feel she's on a higher moral ground ????????????


For some,its just a question of a "tissue" and for others it makes a world of a difference...

I mean,we dont say that teenage sex or underage sex isnt a big deal because afterall its just a "tissue" which has been ruptured...I mean,that sounds reallyAngryAngryAngry but when we are arguing saying that afterall its just a matter of a tissue,then even the abovementioned are cases of the rupture of a tissue..

That sounds just so preposterous right,the same way as saying that "afterall its just a tissue" .....

Originally posted by Aparna_BD


The point is the "virgins" tend to always portray that "holier than thou" attitude all on the basis of a tissue


There's much more to it than just a tissue(atleast to me)..As I said,it speaks volumes about one's moral rectitude,one's self restraint Big smile..besides,its hard for me to believe that the "non virgin" wouldnt suffer from even an iota of guilt... Confused

 

Ok,tell me,how would you feel if you uncover your sister's or your daughter's having had sex with someone ...would you whole heartedly advocate itWink simply because you feel that the girl is an adult and its just a question of a tissue




Edited by Buffie - 10 July 2006 at 7:25am

Morgoth

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Posted: 10 July 2006 at 7:23am | IP Logged
The entire issue over here is starting a marriage based on a lie. Relationships have deteriorated over issues which are even more minor than virginity.

What's the point of getting married to a person if you're afraid to share things with them?

Maybe the guy is not right for you if he places that much importance on virginity.

Plus lying because of "society" is not an excuse. Where did "society" go when a person decided to have premarital sex?



insouciance

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insouciance

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Posted: 10 July 2006 at 7:29am | IP Logged

Originally posted by T.

The entire issue over here is starting a marriage based on a lie. Relationships have deteriorated over issues which are even more minor than virginity.

What's the point of getting married to a person if you're afraid to share things with them?

Maybe the guy is not right for you if he places that much importance on virginity.

Plus lying because of "society" is not an excuse. Where did "society" go when a person decided to have premarital sex?



well said T.ClapClapClap

Aparna_BD

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Posted: 10 July 2006 at 8:22am | IP Logged
Wacko
Originally posted by Buffie

Ok,tell me,how would you feel if you uncover your sister's or your daughter's having had sex with someone ...would you whole heartedly advocate itWink simply because you feel that the girl is an adult and its just a question of a tissue




You want to know about me ? No, i wouldn't have any issues with my daughter or little sister having sex as long as she's an ADULT !! And don't make presumptions that a non- virgin has even an iota of guilt in them !!

There now everything you said proves my point that virgins believe they are on higher moral ground . They are so wrong. But they can sure give themselves a pat on the back for all that self - restraint and what they believe is "moral rectitude" !!!Geek


Edited by Aparna_BD - 10 July 2006 at 8:43am

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