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Madhubala - Ek Ishq Ek Junoon
Madhubala - Ek Ishq Ek Junoon

Episode 121 Discussion: 9th Nov 2012 (Page 8)

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Posted: 09 November 2012 at 9:25pm | IP Logged
Originally posted by zoya_naziya

Originally posted by Soundarya22

[QUOTE=0-SD-0]
So many things about Radhaji annoy me...did you notice on thursday's episode, she asks the servant about RK? AND SHE ASKS HIM ABOUT MB's CALL...baat ki RK ne acche se or something, and the servant, same Bhabhiji's chamcha, blushes and says yes!!! What sort of mother asks the servant about an interaction between her son and her DIL!!! Weird, weird...no wonder RK is so messed up, poor thing!

You nailed it there!!!! I was appalled with this act of Radhaji... I am very irritated with the behavior of hers The last straw was when she said "kya hai yeh ladki" and  ended her Madhu jaap with " Na bete se raha ja raha hai na maa se" i literally wanted to pull my hair out in frustration... 

OMG!!!! You too ? Another bout of ROFL ROFL ROFLROFL ROFLROFL

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Posted: 09 November 2012 at 10:00pm | IP Logged
Shri, Madhu is naive and yet to learn the ropes of surviving in this bad bad world of hers... RK will just show her the real faces ,give her a reality check,and not actually win the battle for her... She only has to and will fight her own battles... 

This malik thing is the first real situation/problem that both are combating together... Rk knowing that she is yet to learn how the world actually works is trying to protect her but 1nce this Malik track ends, RK will realise that she is quite strong enough to handle her own problems and she is not the damsel in distress waiting for her knight in shining armor... 

Hopefully from this point on, he will start molding her to the ways of the world and though she might not like the harsh reality and the things that she might have to do, she would still go ahead and fight it out with her contenders with RK backing her all the way... This for me  fits the line "Roothi hoon phir bhi main raazi"----------->I would like to know what you ppl think of it...

I always thought that Trishna would be a formidable foe for Madhu only when RK starts to chalk out a plan for Madhu to enter the filmy duniya... Till then she will just keep barking, lamenting, feeling jealous,etc,etc and nothing too potent..

And  methinks this Malik revelation is the start for Madhu to unburden herself of the familial pressures and shed her emotional attachments... When she comes to realise that her pujaniya Malik himself can stoop down to committing such a heinous act, then Trishna, whom she already knows is not a "doodh ki dhuli hui insaan", can do things to turn the tides in her favor.. So she will actually fight it out with her and not succumb to the family /emotional attachment

As of now I cannot comment on Dipali's role in the future.. 

As i told in one of our old ED, Radhaji has a lot more layers to her character than the one she is portraying... I have always felt her to be one cunning lady who is plainly using Madhu to reach out to her son that she lost 17 years ago... 17 years ago, she played a gamble by remarrying and in the process she lost out her son... She wants her son back at any cost, coz whatever be it, she very well knows that only RK is of her own blood and she cannot rely on Sikky/Dips/Kukku.. She is just biding her time now as RK is not one whom she can really call her own as of now...  prolly once her equation with RK changes, you never know kya tevar dikhayengi woh? 

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Posted: 09 November 2012 at 11:01pm | IP Logged
This show has shown a lot of dysfunctional families while I guess that's what makes it different than saas bahu dramas that just promote the family values over everything. Most families are not fairy tales we all hope them to be and both Madhu and RK are shown to have dark past.

P.S I don't think Radhaji is strong enough to became a dangerous villain she will most likely become another dipali who tries and fails.

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Posted: 09 November 2012 at 11:36pm | IP Logged
Okay Zoya, Sona,

Those were excellent posts you made...the last two ones.

Now I need to give you material once I collected from other thread ...that could be thought about. From morning reading Sona's posts and then Zoe's posts, I was thinking ...should I provide or not. But now...Sona wrote that "dysfunctional families"...and that's it, now you girls need to go about this.

Its long long material... but I am not going to give all...I will leave mine and Doves's analysis, out from whatever we discussed earlier to the newly collected material. But  I have summarised it in gist...a little of that in the compilation. If you want those posts or material, you ask me later.

So here it goes..


>>>>>>>>

Episode 113 - Oct 30th 2012


Over Shamsher-RK confrontation scene

By Leela

>>>>The Shamsher scene probably had even more impact for RK than most because with Kukku as a rearing-father example, Shamsher being an obsessively murderously protective father-figure is likely to warm the cockles of RK's heart into unmerited leniency. Sincerely hope not, but 'provoked into murder-attempts' apparently is better or at least on par with 'provoked into vicious slander'. Sorry, really wish I had your aptitude for humour to put that better, but Mallick trying to murder someone for the third time even with the knowledge that the person has made a place in his daughter's heart has me completely confounded. 


By FQ responding to Leela

>>>>Leela: the only thing that makes Malik acceptable if he is seen through the lens of the deewana, or the junoon. Which, RK does with great perspicacity, almost saintly detachment. Because guy had just been attacked. Thrice. Rk  may indeed be as superhuman as he claims to be.

Or, as you say, the Particular reasoning that drives Malik appeals to him -- that of the obsessively protective father, which appeals to the lad suffering from issues of  abandonment. Agree completely.


By SD - continuing on the "confounded state of the viewer + Shamsher"

>>>>>btw...the word confounded in that previous post of yours made me watch the scene again. And this is what I felt. I mean I understand his junooni love for his daughter...but then why the junooni madness when each time RK talks about him being his daughter's husband ? Now that puzzles me.


RK says, "Pativrata Patni ban gayi meri nazron mein."  Shamsher tries to assault him again. Look at the hatred or anger whatever it is he has for RK for becoming his daughter's husband.

But then RK's ringing voice and his piercing eyes stopped Shamsher in his madness track. Now Shammu is confounded. Don't know what Shammu must have read in that eyes. To me RK's eyes were quite fearless of Shammu and looking very bluntly at Shammu. He himself is guy with extreme emotions and may be Shammu got that feel. May be that confounded Shammu. No? Maybe that's why that fearlessness makes him talk about his like for daring feats (dileri) and then that blunt look at him from RK makes Shamsher go for revelation of his pain, that it hurts him because his daughter gave place to RK in her heart. Now how that make any sense. Scratching my head here !! 


FQ's response to that

>>>>To me it is the sexual component of marriage. RK knows and WE know it is non-existant (alas) but Malik doesn't.  Rk plays it for the reaction, Malik reacts. 


And read the exploration into Shamsher further - FODDER MATERIAL




Shamsher as the Father - Yet another Failure for a Father

By napstermonster

>>>>I'm brand new to the forum, and to this show (IPKKND is my old stomping ground) so please pardon this if its a repetition of something that has been observed. I have been watching older clips and what stuck me today, is that this show is basically about, parents,and rising above the crap they inflict on you.Perhaps even, about learning lessons on what not to do from their actions, and recovering from them--not your usual "maata-pitah ijjj alvayyyss mahaan" line. if you look at the damage that fathers have done--and in this context, I speak of all the fathers on this show, they have been directly responsible for the crippled psychological state that their kids are in. Damaged children through the choices of the fathers--and in this, aside from Madhu and RK I would include Sikki as well-- that seems to be the common denominator.


What I saw in Shamsher today was the final nail in the Daddy-Issues coffin for me. If he understands Madhu's feelings, and if he realizes that his daughter has fallen in love with this man, the fact that he is trying to kill RK is now because of his own pride, and hatred, indifference and ultimately, selfishness. Love plays no part in this--and I dont say that because the thought of hurting a man who looks like that is sacrilegious, though, of course, it is.

Each emotion that Shamser is feeling, that has led him to fashion a dildo out of ice is something every other horrible dad has felt in this show so far---Indiifference towards a very intense young son, something that RK's dead dad must have felt while killing himself, or the evil of Madhu's real dad, who hated his daughter for being born, or Kuku, the Colors Channel's bitch-slap-to-the-face answer to Walt Disney's wicked step-mother trope.

I just hope that the damage that his dad's abandonment has inflicted is not taken to the extreme here--that RK realizes that by trying to kill him, Shamsher is feeding his own ego and need for revenge, and not acting out of any concern for his daughter. Shamsher is as much of a damaging father figure now as RK's own was for RK. He needs to pay, even if that payment is by acknowledging that he has "lost" his little girl to the man he despises, and finding himself helpless in the face of her love, and regretful for having done any attempts in the first place. Then of course, he can use that dildo. 


FQ's response to napstermonster

>>> Agree. Agree. Agree. 


And thanks for bringing in poor Sikki and Kukku into the fold of this discussion.


Re Malik, however, I would also like you to consider the recent trauma he has been through: not just the physical hurt, but the ritual emasculation. He, a stunt man, who prides himself on his physical prowess, was beaten up to a ragged pulp. Then, and Malik sees and articulates this more than ANYONE else ( in fact, no one else even refers to it) RK takes his daughter. In Malik's eyes the imagery is that of rape. Of despoilation. Invasion. 


And this is a psychological assault on his masculinity. He reacts, not cleverly, but as directed by his testosterone, which has been  making idiots of men a lot longer than Malik has  quoth a filmy dialogue. Clearly, his decision making is severely affected by this loss of mental equilibrium.


Not surprising that he fashioned a knife to kill RK. First the huge-ass scimitar of serration in the hospital, and then the dildo of ice... He wants to physically assault RK, to penetrate his defenses in much the same way he has seen his daughter, and through her, himself despoiled.


Should we see this logic be ratified by RK? Ideally, no. But to RK this obsessive behaviour is justified, even honourable. I fear he won't be marching Malik off to the nearest shrink any time soon...


They're all pretty damaged, aren't they?


by SD in continuation

>>>>Leela, You might remember my post in Shamsher...the hero. FQ talks about the same. The masculinity complex...the physical prowess. I had given reasons while discussing with Doves how even the power/wealth status of RK unsettles Shamsher so much that he adds up all his failures of life and attributes it to the likes of RK. And FQ now has given an extension to the man about why he wants so much to lay his hands on this powerful man. Baser instincts in all of this through that sexual imagery. OMG!! this is what I depicted in his character, albeit through use of power and money factor which is another way to understand him, his basal way of looking at things, not capable of higher mental reasoning.


By FQ

>>>>SD Re Shamsher:  agree, the money, power, success and sexual conquest of his daughter-- all aspects of his emasculation. which also strips him of his honour ( perhaps he should have seen the RK's loan as a debt of honour according to some reckonings) and good sense. BUT he can argue that the debt would not exist except for RK's petty cruelty.


>>>>>>



Edited by 0-SD-0 - 09 November 2012 at 11:38pm

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Posted: 10 November 2012 at 12:03am | IP Logged
Before signing off for the day (I  am not promising, I won't be back!!)...I'm going off on a tangent to provide some relief ...

Come on, break to banta hai, since we have a lot to discuss and a weekend without Madhubala... Found this song, and am dedicating it to Rishbala, ..hummable, apt lyrics, and one little thing in the chorus that made me think of themWink...am sure everyone on this forum will notice it and agree with me.

Enjoy...


http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ZSFTiwaR0go...


if the link does'nt work...the song is' Tujhko jo paaya' from a movie called 'Crook'.

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Posted: 10 November 2012 at 12:06am | IP Logged
Zoya,

Re Radhaji using MB and biding her time...Ditto here. I fear her, Coz she is a failure and wants to win. That's why I called her grey. She is not like Dips, because she is not an idiot like Dips to not see MB's power. Like Dips, Radhaji is no conceited fool or arrogant. She is just biding her time.  

Word it...what you said there...tevar kaise badlenge.

And re
>>> "Roothi hoon phir bhi main raazi"----------->I would like to know what you ppl think of it...

This I feel as MB wanting to be controlled by RK. 

Remember how I explained the twisting of the finger that day (7th Nov scene). When RK twists her finger and bends it down completely, Madhu is actually angry first. Even RK is like "mujhe dikhane chali ungli...but he's already feeling bad that she makes him do bad things. And both turn away from each other upset. But MB is first to relent and she starts smiling, Actually she wants to show more of her mirth. RK also wants to look at her. He catches her smile. Quite surprised. He relaxes, She too relaxes and both start laughing.

So they are upset together and happy together, inspite of how one controlled the other. RK doesn't like to control MB, but it is his need to be in control. Whereas MB doesn't have to fear challenging RK, she can do whatever she wants with him when she feels justified, and yet if RK changes her path or overpowers her, she doesn't mind that. She is happy even at that loss because she still will have the pleasure of challenging him and him feeling bad that he has to overpower her. MB has started to feel this way since she saw RK's caring side. So she knows, if she is hurt, he is gonna be hurt too. So ki farak painda hai, kaun haara kaun jeeta.

That's why, it will be "Roothi hoon phir bhi main raazi" for MB.


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Posted: 10 November 2012 at 12:08am | IP Logged
Shri, that was brilliant analysis. I was just trying figure out Shamsher by relating to him as a father. But the physical defeat he experienced the first time due to RK was like a huge insult to his manhood. This is the same shamsher who could take on many goons at once but got defeated to RK's power. I wonder if he really thought RK was talking of a sexual relationship. hHHmm... I thought the way RK humiliated Madhu through the media was enough for any father to lose their marbles but the forceful marriage with the thought of sexual relations does add fire to the fuel. Very well analyzed.

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Posted: 10 November 2012 at 12:24am | IP Logged
Originally posted by 0-SD-0

Zoya,
And re
>>> "Roothi hoon phir bhi main raazi"----------->I would like to know what you ppl think of it...

This I feel as MB wanting to be controlled by RK. 

Remember how I explained the twisting of the finger that day (7th Nov scene). When RK twists her finger and bends it down completely, Madhu is actually angry first. Even RK is like "mujhe dikhane chali ungli...but he's already feeling bad that she makes him do bad things. And both turn away from each other upset. But MB is first to relent and she starts smiling, Actually she wants to show more of her mirth. RK also wants to look at her. He catches her smile. Quite surprised. He relaxes, She too relaxes and both start laughing.

So they are upset together and happy together, inspite of how one controlled the other. RK doesn't like to control MB, but it is his need to be in control. Whereas MB doesn't have to fear challenging RK, she can do whatever she wants with him when she feels justified, and yet if RK changes her path or overpowers her, she doesn't mind that. She is happy even at that loss because she still will have the pleasure of challenging him and him feeling bad that he has to overpower her. MB has started to feel this way since she saw RK's caring side. So she knows, if she is hurt, he is gonna be hurt too. So ki farak painda hai, kaun haara kaun jeeta.

That's why, it will be "Roothi hoon phir bhi main raazi" for MB.

What you say makes a lot more sense... Nah! you are actually right... The more i think of it this way, the more i feel better about this line:) 

@Shamsher: Great analysis and you people have touched upon  all the plausible aspects.Clap


Edited by zoya_naziya - 10 November 2012 at 12:34am

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