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PR this week: Purvi deconstructed (Page 15)

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Posted: 09 September 2012 at 2:18pm | IP Logged
No, Janhvi, it is not true that one is expected to feel sad only for those whom one loves, not at all. If one is a decent person, one feels very sorry and sad for anyone whom one has hurt, especially if one does not love him or her. It is partly guilt for not being able to love that person back, and partly because one always has a soft corner for those who love one. For Arjun, there was the added factor of Ovi being someone he had known all his life and was very fond of as well. Purvi, who is so mahaan, actually feels very sad for Ovi because she is her aai' s  daughter.

Where I do not agree with Kool's impassioned argument is when she cites Kannagi as a role model for Ovi. Kannagi was married to Kovalan, and they were very happily married too, till Madhavi turned up. Here, there is no such bond to be preserved at all costs, only  a matter of fact agreement that he would marry Ovi, one that he entered into precisely because he did not love her and was sure that he would  never commit the folly of falling in love with any (other) girl.

No, Ovi is not  the interloper in Arjun's relationship with Purvi, for she was there first, in whatever sense, and no one held a gun to Arjun's head and made him agree to marry her.  However, the key fact  is that the Arjun she claims as her own no longer exists. All that exists is a besotted fool, who is prepared to lie down for Purvi to walk all over him, and this is probably never going to change, however clenched his jaw is as of now.  It is thus pointless for Ovi to cite her relationship with the old Arjun in order to claim the new one. But she is like a child who wants the moon and will not give up  when she is told that it is out of her reach. And no one who cares for her seems able to get her out of this fixation which is merely  destructive, above all self-destructive, because it can never work.

These things happen even to people who are both in love to start with, when one of them falls out of love and  moves away to someone else. Here the love was one-sided to start with (I do not question Ovi's love for Arjun, or downgrade it in comparison to Purvi's, especially after the mahaan tyaag), and it has become even more so now. She cannot marry this new Arjun thru a deal - for contrary to what Kool claims, it is not just Purvi who trades him like a doll, Ovi buys him in exactly the same way - and expect it to  work.

All this said, after seeing the way the love of the new Arjun's life has treated him and his obsession for her, I am convinced that Manav was right, and Arjun would have been far better off as the old Arjun, married to an undemanding Ovi and comfortable in placid domesticity.

When this matter came up earlier, you used to argue vehemently about the delights of true love that he would have missed out on. Now that we have seen the way this kind of imbalanced "true love' has worked for Arjun, the argument in favour of his never having tasted of this Circe's brew is stronger than ever. He might not have been turned into a pig, as in the Odyssey, but he has definitely become a tame poodle. What a fall!

Shyamala

Originally posted by soapwatcher1

Kool, I would not expect Arjun or Purvi to feel sad for Ovi in the same way that I would expect Ovi to feel sad for Arjun for the sole reason, Arjun and Purvi do not love Ovi, Ovi allegedly "loves" Arjun, so I for one do expect her to show some compassion to him, she is 19 and children at a much younger age "feel" for you if you are upset or crying. She is not a teeny babe wrapped in a blanket, if she is old enough to love a man and feel extremes of emotion for him, she better well feel for the guy's pain. As Arjun said, she is the outsider, the interloper in his relationship with Purvi, who cares if she believes she loves him and wants him?

Wanting something that does not belong to you is considered one of the seven deadly sins.

Jyothi, a leopard does not change its spots that quickly not even in PR. At the reception, Ovi tells Archana to come back home because if she doesn't, "Arjun will never accept her (Ovi)". She is still thinking of herself and herself alone. The other two gave up their love for the sale of others, one for her mother and the other for love's sake, idiots two. I have no patience with those two either but just for that reason to raise Ovi and her selfishness onto a predestal personifying true love, my reasoning will never allow.

Yes, there is a probability if they stay married Ovi might in time actually grow to love him more than she does herself. There was more of a possibility if the other two had gotten married they would have achieved that status much earlier, of loving the other above all else. Arjun already did/does and Purvi would have learned to value him above her mother. The two girls learning to love him above all else is conjecture at this point so moot.

So Kool, I beg to differ though I absolutely love reading your posts. (I liked that reference to Kannagi, long time since I heard her name)


Edited by sashashyam - 10 September 2012 at 1:41am

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Posted: 09 September 2012 at 2:35pm | IP Logged
Dear Kalapi,

Teju does stick to her guns when Ovi starts on her sermon to her dad, but then Ovi goes on and on justifying her change of heart towards Archana and citing various specific reasons for it. At that point. Teju falls back on the Soham disaster, when Manav jumps in and negates her argument completely. So , when Teju's defences against Archana have already been seriously weakened, and by people she trusts, the forged signature issue turns up and topples her over completely. At least this is how I see it. The hysterical babbling to Manav at the party is a typical emotional overreaction to this sudden change of perspective, and one that has very little to do with logic.

Shyamala

Originally posted by Kalapi

Varsha, I actually am also already disappointed with Teju too. As Kool said somewhere already, she just knows the half truth jumped and went to the judge. Did she try finding out what happened 18 yrs before, as you said? The forged signature is only 6 months old, then why were Arman separated 18 yrs? Besides, should she have confronted Savita, her grandmother and Dad before including a third person? So, is she planning to put her aaji who raised her for 18 yrs for a mom who never looked back at her for 18 yrs??? Did she have to do the drama crying for her innocent mom in the party'.Innocent mom, really'OK, I guess'don't know if I as a granddaughter, could have done what she did'.So, by this I can only conclude, that the Cvs are trying hard to push it down our throat that Arman separated only because Savita didn't like her DIL'.how convenient and lopsided, as you say all the timeSmile'.

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Posted: 09 September 2012 at 4:54pm | IP Logged
Originally posted by Dabulls23

Originally posted by soapwatcher1

Kool, let us all collectively pray that Soham never changes and stays true to character like his sister, Tej. He has such a sparkle in his eyes and an impishness about him, hard to resist. Cannot believe he was born to two serious, "bearing the world on their shoulders" parents. Oh, forgot, this is Shyamala's thread ;) she will be after me with a mop if she hears me praising my "doosra ladla" on her thread!

Kool, you took me back to my college days, Kannagi, Kovalan, the chillambu, and all the lovely poetry, par excellence. Need to go read it again. It also reminded me for some reason of Bharatiyar and his achamillai achamillai (love that!).

Varsha, I am a water sign like you and sigh, a romantic too!   I have noticed most of the people on the forum are. LOL
Janhavi
Tej may take a 180 degree turn as she only knows half truth...She does not know rest about what her mother has done...Only what Savita-Sachu has done...Does not know all what has happened 19 and 18 yrs back...Savita never told them abt Soham on her own...They just found out because of the photo..
 
CVs will butcher Tej also as she will be under the K influence of Sanskars...Sanskar is like substance...They lose their thinking capability and become airheads...
 
I like Soham-Vishnu too but he is defo on the verge of being transformed in to something else..Varsha will be forgiven but not savita...If manav can forgive Varsha, manju, Dharmesh and Rasika after losing their first unborn than Varsha to only kidnapped Soham OuchWackoLOL
 
Glad to know u r water sign too...Yeah I used to be hopelessly romantic too at one time...But to me its all over rated WinkLOL
 
If Varsha can be forgiven, Savita has to be forgiven, if both can be forgiven then my doosra ladla cannot go behind bars, plea bargain, turning in his gunda baap, Balan in exchange for his freedom (the last the boy will never do, I can swear on it), anything but the boy has to walk free!!  LOL


Edited by soapwatcher1 - 09 September 2012 at 4:53pm

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Posted: 09 September 2012 at 4:58pm | IP Logged
Originally posted by koolsadhu1000

Yes SW  I  always understood Kannagi for her quiet devotion to her husband although am personally incapable of it ...i understand these women as they do it as a personal choice . Who am i to judge right .LOLSmile I also felt for Madhavi ...only Kovalan got my disapproval coz i personally felt he did not deserve the two women . It is my personal belief that he left Madhavi  when the euphoria of physical intimacy was over . In hindi they say Jee Bhar Gaya .LOLLOL The excuse he gave for his sudden realisation was very convenient .LOLLOL

Varsha superb post .
 
Kool, I do not like Kovalan either, and I agree that kind of devotion is to be read about in awe but I am incapable of it as well.  Wait with patience for your cheating husband to come back to you when you have given your everything to him for years, what a waste!  And then to tear out your flesh and throw it in angst, that too for an erring husband who returned home to you, never in a million years.  Kind of lopsided there, two women cheated by the same man, sad!   But the strength of that devotion is to be admired. 

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Posted: 09 September 2012 at 5:25pm | IP Logged
Originally posted by sashashyam

No, Janhvi, it is not true that one is expected to feel sad only for those whom one loves, not at all. If one is a decent person, one feels very sorry and sad for anyone whom one has hurt, especially if one does not love him or her. It is partly guilt for not being able to love that person back, and partly because one always has a soft corner for those who love one. For Arjun, there was the added factor of Ovi being someone he had known all his life and was very fond of as well. Purvi, who is so mahaan, actually feels very sad for Ovi because she is her aai' s  daughter.

Where I do not agree with Kool's impassioned argument is when she cites Kannagi as a role model for Ovi. Kannagi was married to Kovalan, and they were very happily married too, till Madhavi turned up. Here, there is no such bond to be preserved at all costs, only  a matter of fact agreement that he would marry Ovi, one that he entered into precisely because he did not love her and was sure that he would  never commit the folly of falling in love with any (other) girl.

Nor is Ovi the interloper in his relationship with Purvi, for she was there first, in whatever sense, and no one held a gun to Arjun's head and made him agree to marry her.  However, the key fact  is that the Arjun she claims as her own no longer exists. All that exists is a besotted fool, who is prepared to lie down for Purvi to walk all over him, and this is probably never going to change, however clenched his jaw is as of now.  It is thus pointless for Ovi to cite her relationship with the old Arjun in order to claim the new one. But she is like a child who wants the moon and will not give up  when she is told that it is out of her reach. And no one who cares for her seems able to get her out of this fixation which is merely  destructive, above all self-destructive, because it can never work.

These things happen even to people who are both in love to start with, when one of them falls out of love and  moves away to someone else. Here the love was one-sided to start with (I do not question Ovi's love for Arjun, or downgrade it in comparison to Purvi's, especially after the mahaan tyaag), and it has become even more so now. She cannot marry this new Arjun thru a deal - for contrary to what Kool claims, it is not just Purvi who trades him like a doll, Ovi buys him in exactly the same way - and expect it to  work.

All this said, after seeing the way the love of the new Arjun's life has treated him and his obsession for her, I am convinced that Manav was right, and Arjun would have been far better off as the old Arjun, married to an undemanding Ovi and comfortable in placid domesticity.

When this matter came up earlier, you used to argue vehemently about the delights of true love that he would have missed out on. Now that we have seen the way this kind of imbalanced "true love' has worked for Arjun, the argument in favour of his never having tasted of this Circe's brew is stronger than ever. He might not have been turned into a pig, as in the Odyssey, but he has definitely become a tame poodle. What a fall!

Shyamala

Originally posted by soapwatcher1

Kool, I would not expect Arjun or Purvi to feel sad for Ovi in the same way that I would expect Ovi to feel sad for Arjun for the sole reason, Arjun and Purvi do not love Ovi, Ovi allegedly "loves" Arjun, so I for one do expect her to show some compassion to him, she is 19 and children at a much younger age "feel" for you if you are upset or crying. She is not a teeny babe wrapped in a blanket, if she is old enough to love a man and feel extremes of emotion for him, she better well feel for the guy's pain. As Arjun said, she is the outsider, the interloper in his relationship with Purvi, who cares if she believes she loves him and wants him?

Wanting something that does not belong to you is considered one of the seven deadly sins.

Jyothi, a leopard does not change its spots that quickly not even in PR. At the reception, Ovi tells Archana to come back home because if she doesn't, "Arjun will never accept her (Ovi)". She is still thinking of herself and herself alone. The other two gave up their love for the sale of others, one for her mother and the other for love's sake, idiots two. I have no patience with those two either but just for that reason to raise Ovi and her selfishness onto a predestal personifying true love, my reasoning will never allow.

Yes, there is a probability if they stay married Ovi might in time actually grow to love him more than she does herself. There was more of a possibility if the other two had gotten married they would have achieved that status much earlier, of loving the other above all else. Arjun already did/does and Purvi would have learned to value him above her mother. The two girls learning to love him above all else is conjecture at this point so moot.

So Kool, I beg to differ though I absolutely love reading your posts. (I liked that reference to Kannagi, long time since I heard her name)
 
Dear Shyamala, agreed, that one has to feel sad about anyone else suffering or in pain, but the hurt is a thousand fold when it is your own or when you love the person, then the hurt breaks your heart, you ache for them.  Definitely, you do not expect Arjun to feel this ache for Ovi or Purvi to feel it for Ovi.  If Ovi loves Arjun, she ought to feel that pain for him. 
 
I have always held in countless posts (the reason why you banned me from PAPCry), that Arjun was wrong in not explaining to Ovi about the broken engagement.  I still hold to toss off a fiancee is bad, to toss her off with indifference and not a word of explanation when she is your best friend, is even worse.  In fact, I kept reiterating that dear Arjun should have taken the time to explain to Ovi his dilemma.
 
(As an aside, my cousin who had a "love marriage" found out that her husband had fallen in love with his colleague.  He did nothing physical about it, the other girl used to come to their home for dinner and parties. Her husband was very open about his feelings for the other girl with his wife, told her he was battling it and that he in no way wanted to cheat her.  My cousin (the greater person, I could never have felt that way) actually felt bad for her husband and understood what he was going through.  The other girl got a transfer, an "affair" never happened but the point of the story is my cousin felt hurt not by the cheating but by the pain her husband was going through.  Strange scenario but true).
 
I agree with your analysis of Kannagi and Kovalan, entirely different scenario, a happily married couple and the husband strays for love of a court dancer, the wife waits patiently to woo her husband back, is not the same as Arjun/Purvi and Ovi.  
 
As for Ovi not being the interloper, Arjun sees her as one and the mere fact of her being there before Purvi does not absolve her from being the third wheel in their relationship.  You can know someone for years but just because you have known them before you fall in love or marry another does not make the first person an insider to your relationship. 
 
As for vehemently arguing on the delights of true love that Arjun might have missed out on, I don't exactly remember it that way. I might have waxed poetical about his intense looks and soul binding confessions of love, who would not have been swayed by the boy's devotion?   But being a hopeless romantic I will say in the words of Tennyson, "Tis better to have loved and lost than never to have loved at all."


Edited by soapwatcher1 - 09 September 2012 at 5:39pm

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Posted: 09 September 2012 at 6:05pm | IP Logged
Awesome post Shyamala! I know many ARVI fans feel it's all Ovi's fault but the ones to blame for this situation are Arjun and Purvi. More than feeling bad for Arjun and Purvi, I felt bad for Ovi when Arjun behaved so rudely to her. I know Ovi was wrong but Arjun and Purvi were wrong to a greater extent. I honestly did not feel any sympathy for Purvi when she was bawling away (a tad bit for Arjun because Purvi  played her game and tossed Arjun away for Aai, but then I wonder if I should feel sorry for him since he was a pathetic loser at the end). Both of them brought this onto themselves and deserve every bit of agony they get. 

Edited by salvatore-nina - 09 September 2012 at 6:14pm

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Posted: 10 September 2012 at 2:21am | IP Logged
Thanks a lot, Nina, I am glad you liked the post (the first one, I presume). I wrote it mainly as catharsis, for I was far too angry just than was appropriate to someone  of age and my supposed maturity!Wink

However  my ranking of the two of them, fault-wise, would be 1) Purvi 100% and 2) Arjun 66%. He is a deewaana,  and one can do nothing about such people, they have no control over themselves, like Majnun or Farhad. Purvi is anything but a deewaanee,  and I have repeated this far too often, but I hope you will bear with just one more time!

It is not just that she dumps him, it is HOW she dumps him. Standing there, after having emotionally bludgeoned the poor sap into submission, watching over his wedding to Ovi with, as Janhvi puts it so well, a stony face.

As for Ovi, I can see where all the people who feel so much for her are coming from, but they are leaving out the one cardinal,unquestionable and totally relevant fact (please see my post to Janhvi above if you have the time). I said there:

"The Arjun she claims as her own no longer exists.
All that exists is a besotted fool, who is prepared to lie down for Purvi to walk all over him, and this is probably never going to change, however clenched his jaw is as of now.  It is thus pointless for Ovi to cite her relationship with the old Arjun in order to claim the new one. But she is like a child who wants the moon and will not give up  when she is told that it is out of her reach. And no one who cares for her seems able to get her out of this fixation which is merely  destructive, because it can never work".

Ovi is trying to transmute fool's gold into the real stuff. It will never come off. In that sense,
she is behaving like a foolish and greedy child, who wants what it wants, and will not accept that the object of  her desire wants above all to run away from her. These things happen, and one has to  write finis  and walk away. If she cannot see that, her family should have made her do so.

And in this blind pursuit of his love, she has wrecked him good and proper,

Forget about Purvi, Ovi does not have to care about her. But since she claims to love Arjun so deeply since she was 14 (God, that cliche!),  should she not care about the gut-wrenching agony Arjun will go thru? She never gives it a thought.

Now, alas, it is too late, and she and he and all the rest of us are in almighty mess. All except Purvi, who must be compensating for any sorrow she might feel at losing Arjun by basking in the warmth of the approval of her aai and her aaji  for her mahaan tyaag,  of course without even a passing thought for the bakra  who made it possible thru his incomprehensible folly.

Those who keep harping on Arjun not having done more to either tell Ovi about Purvi much earlier, or to do more to comfort her now,  are barking up the  wrong tree. He did try to do the first very early, and again and again later, though ineffectively, because he could not be blunt with her. As for the second, it would have been a non-starter, and he would have faced a torrent of hysteria that he would have been totally ill-equipped to handle. Most men are not.

Where his 66% comes from is for not having turned Purvi down flat, given her back her ring, taken his own, and legged it back to Canada by the next flight, of course sans Ovi. Perhaps it should be 75%, and mostly for having committed the folly of falling in love with this aai(  and baba and now dada)- obsessed girl in the first place.

I repeat myself again, but it was exactly like buying a house with a triple mortgage. More fool he! But I feel for him as if my Sasha had committed a similar folly. I feel nothing but anger for Purvi.

Finally, I don;t think that too many of us Arjun-Purvi fans feel that it was all Ovi's fault. She is the one who first proposes that deal , and to that extent she is a prime mover and is thus at fault majorly.One does not try to buy love so blatantly and foolishly after having seen all that Purvi means to Arjun.

But it is Purvi, who is Arjun's life and who claims to love him so much and who promises repeatedly never to leave him, who clinches the deal. It is she who delivers that boy  to Ovi, sealed and bound hand and foot by his obsession for her.

Ovi owes Arjun nothing, but Purvi should have cared for what he would go thru if she was able to make him the sacrificial goat. She did not,and so she is primarily to blame. At least that is how I feel.

Shyamala


Originally posted by salvatore-nina

Awesome post Shyamala! I know many ARVI fans feel it's all Ovi's fault but the ones to blame for this situation are Arjun and Purvi. More than feeling bad for Arjun and Purvi, I felt bad for Ovi when Arjun behaved so rudely to her. I know Ovi was wrong but Arjun and Purvi were wrong to a greater extent. I honestly did not feel any sympathy for Purvi when she was bawling away (a tad bit for Arjun because Purvi  played her game and tossed Arjun away for Aai, but then I wonder if I should feel sorry for him since he was a pathetic loser at the end). Both of them brought this onto themselves and deserve every bit of agony they get. 

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Posted: 10 September 2012 at 2:40am | IP Logged
Janhvi,

I  think you need not have bothered to refute my take on the interloper angle. There is no one take on this. For  that matter, if Arjun says Ovi is the interloper, Purvi says that she herself is the interloper. Apni apni soch hai.

It is really irrelevant, to my mind, who it is. What IS relevant is that Ovi is staking a  prior right to a phantom. That Arjun no longer exists. I would have expected you to concentrate on that point, for it is the only one that counts. Proceeding from that, all that Ovi does is foolish in the extreme, unethical, and destructive. Not that one cares about such things when one is in love or loves deeply. Look at what Purvi does to her beloved Arjun just because she loves her aai  to the exclusion of all else.

I was fascinated by your cousin's story. She must be a very strong woman, and it is obvious that she loves her husband the way one loves a child, above all protectively. I hope he realises his good fortune in having her.

I don't know about Tennyson, but I would rather not have all these delights for 3 months, if the aftermath is to be years of misery. I am not very sure if, despite your self-proclaimed status as  a hopeless romantic, you would settle for such a devil's bargain for yourself.Wink

Shyamala


Originally posted by soapwatcher1

Dear Shyamala, agreed, that one has to feel sad about anyone else suffering or in pain, but the hurt is a thousand fold when it is your own or when you love the person, then the hurt breaks your heart, you ache for them.  Definitely, you do not expect Arjun to feel this ache for Ovi or Purvi to feel it for Ovi.  If Ovi loves Arjun, she ought to feel that pain for him. 
 
I have always held in countless posts (the reason why you banned me from PAPCry), that Arjun was wrong in not explaining to Ovi about the broken engagement.  I still hold to toss off a fiancee is bad, to toss her off with indifference and not a word of explanation when she is your best friend, is even worse.  In fact, I kept reiterating that dear Arjun should have taken the time to explain to Ovi his dilemma.
 
(As an aside, my cousin who had a "love marriage" found out that her husband had fallen in love with his colleague.  He did nothing physical about it, the other girl used to come to their home for dinner and parties. Her husband was very open about his feelings for the other girl with his wife, told her he was battling it and that he in no way wanted to cheat her.  My cousin (the greater person, I could never have felt that way) actually felt bad for her husband and understood what he was going through.  The other girl got a transfer, an "affair" never happened but the point of the story is my cousin felt hurt not by the cheating but by the pain her husband was going through.  Strange scenario but true).
 
I agree with your analysis of Kannagi and Kovalan, entirely different scenario, a happily married couple and the husband strays for love of a court dancer, the wife waits patiently to woo her husband back, is not the same as Arjun/Purvi and Ovi.  
 
As for Ovi not being the interloper, Arjun sees her as one and the mere fact of her being there before Purvi does not absolve her from being the third wheel in their relationship.  You can know someone for years but just because you have known them before you fall in love or marry another does not make the first person an insider to your relationship. 
 
As for vehemently arguing on the delights of true love that Arjun might have missed out on, I don't exactly remember it that way. I might have waxed poetical about his intense looks and soul binding confessions of love, who would not have been swayed by the boy's devotion?   But being a hopeless romantic I will say in the words of Tennyson, "Tis better to have loved and lost than never to have loved at all."
sashashyam:

Nor is Ovi the interloper in his relationship with Purvi, for she was there first, in whatever sense, and no one held a gun to Arjun's head and made him agree to marry her.  However, the key fact  is that the Arjun she claims as her own no longer exists. All that exists is a besotted fool, who is prepared to lie down for Purvi to walk all over him, and this is probably never going to change, however clenched his jaw is as of now.  It is thus pointless for Ovi to cite her relationship with the old Arjun in order to claim the new one. But she is like a child who wants the moon and will not give up  when she is told that it is out of her reach. And no one who cares for her seems able to get her out of this fixation which is merely  destructive, because it can never work.

These things happen even to people who are both in love to start with, when one of them falls out of love and  moves away to someone else. Here the love was one-sided to start with (I do not question Ovi's love for Arjun, or downgrade it in comparison to Purvi's, especially after the mahaan tyaag), and it has become even more so now. She cannot marry this new Arjun thru a deal - for contrary to what Kool claims, it is not just Purvi who trades him like a doll, Ovi buys him in exactly the same way - and expect it to  work.


Shyamala




Edited by sashashyam - 10 September 2012 at 2:47am

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laali4shekhar 4 1201 17 June 2009 at 10:33pm by Millerrr88

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