+* Portrayal of Krishna's wives *+ (Page 7)

rai-kishori. IF-Sizzlerz

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Posted: 06 February 2012 at 10:45pm | IP Logged

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Great !!

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.Vrish. Viewbie

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Posted: 08 February 2012 at 12:55pm | IP Logged

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Shivang

I moved the wives discussion to this thread. Hope you're okay w/ it - although I'm fragmenting this discussion, I find it a lot easier to manage, since we're covering so many aspects in just a single post. Similarly, I've discussed the curious Kaurava attitude in the Mahabharata thread, and Karna's in the Pandava thread.

Originally posted by ShivangBuch

Originally posted by .Vrish.

On Krishna's wives, his 8 principle wives are the ones who he married first - since that's how the hierarchy of sautans was determined. So even his marriage to Lakshmanaa had to have happened b4 Narakasura's death. I know that SB does not follow a chronological order - Banasura's war is described pretty early, as is Rukmi's death. If Rukmi was there to offer his services to both sides in Udyog Parva, his death had to have happened in the 36 years b/w the end of the Kauravas and the end of the Yadavas & Pandavas.

I still can't agree that other 5 principle wives had to marry Krishna chronologically before those 16,100 wives in order to be counted as principal wives. I think those 5 wives might have got higher status (Or just specific separately known identities nothing else) just because of their stature and position before marriage (relative to those helpless 16,100 wives also too many in number all equal reducing their individual importance) and the way Krishna married them. The chronology rule for status may not be applicable in all cases or especially such abnormal case. Those 16,100 wives may just be formal wives rescued by Krishna and under his shelter in Dwarika.

One thing however, that I do strongly believe in is that even though Krishna acted in ways that most people wouldn't consider acceptable for normal people to act in (I think Parikshit once asked one of the rishis why did Krishna act in a way that is normally considered unethical, wrt putting the robes of the gopis on a tree or serenading them), there were some things that he just didn't do. While it's true that he married these 16,100 women out of compassion for them, one can argue that he had more than enough wives. If after having 16,103 wives, he'd go on to marry Kalindhi, Mitravindya, Bhadra, Satya & Lakshmanaa, it paints a very unfavorable impression of him, as either someone who condones women going after much married men, or even worse, someone who has an insatiable appetite for women. For me, either is unthinkable.

Had Krishna already had 16,103 wives, I doubt that he'd have married these 5. However, since he had 8 wives, which was normal, he'd normally have stopped, but decided to give these 16,100 a new stature. Otherwise, the message it would have sent men would have been that it's okay to go after as many women as one feels like, which, even for a polygamous society, would have been overkill.

I also cannot imagine those 5 wanting Krishna as a husband if he already had 16,103 wives. While any princess would have loved to be the wife of a hero like him even if he had a few wives, if he had that many, they'd pause. That's part of why I think that the Narakasura wives were the last wives he had.

Edited by .Vrish. - 08 February 2012 at 1:24pm

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Posted: 13 February 2012 at 2:02am | IP Logged

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Well, at the moment, I can't argue without reading in detail the earlier pages about the stories of marriages of Krishna with his other 5 principal wives but what I feel is that these 16,100 wives as wives had only symbolic significance for giving them status (and known to everybody) and with noble cause to rescue them and to provide them the shelter and other 5 wives would have married to Krishna in any situation any time even after any number of wives if he was Krishna because they were Lakshmi's incarnations. How it would look to the society would have been immaterial if the relation of souls was eternal and were destined to meet. Destiny would have made it possible in any case. And Krishna followed the essence of dharma many times in a way that ordinary person would not truly or fully understand its righteousness. What I believe or have known so far is that Krishna's marriages (whether of his own or to support Arjun for Draupadi & Subhadra) were all either to save a life or to achieve unselfish political aim of dharm sansthapan in aaryaavart or to respond to eternal love with eternal consorts (or prior birth promises). Even if sources use the words like 'Krishna got attracted' towards someone like say Satyabhama or Mitravindaa or Lakshmanaa; I can only imagine Ramji attracted towards Sitaji in pushpvatika as pure vibrations of love. So Bhagdatt's presence in Draupadi swayamvar and Narakasur's presence on earth at that time is still an unconcluded and complex doubt in my mind. I don't deny your logical POV. That is clearly explained and practical enough.

Edited by ShivangBuch - 13 February 2012 at 2:05am

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Posted: 16 February 2012 at 3:47am | IP Logged

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Okay, Rukmini is back in the new track about Pradhyumna. One thing I wanted to know - does HV narrate her knowing in advance that Pradhyumna was going to be kidnapped (as shown in the serial?) SB clearly writes nothing of the sort.

Anyway, one thing that struck me - normally, Rukmini was supposed to be as omniscient as Krishna himself, as illustrated during the Tulabharam episodes, and yet, when Pradhyumna was kidnapped, she was shattered (SB 10.55.15). Wouldn't she have been as informed as Krishna about Pradhyumna's need to slay Shambara?

Note that I'm now discussing more what's actually in the scriptures, rather than what's shown in the serial.

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Posted: 01 March 2012 at 9:30am | IP Logged

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This serial continues to disgust, finding newer & innovative ways of blaspheming Shri Krishna.

On Tuesday's episode, they showed Rukmini on the verge of stabbing herself, when Jambavati stopped her. Itself an extreme depiction, since the person who mattered most to Rukmini was Krishna, not Pradhyumna. In fact, in Devi Bhagvatam, Krishna approached some deity to get more sons from all his wives, so that they'd all be happy w/ their marriages. So Rukmini, like the others, had her next 9 sons, led by Charudeshna, and her daughter, Charumati.

Anyway, Jambavati, in order to comfort Rukmini, told her that her baby was still alive. Krishna then came in and busted that 'bubble' by telling Rukmini that that baby was indeed alive - in their hearts - implying that the baby was dead. This was beyond sadistic - first of all, Krishna lying, and what's worse, doing so to destroy whatever hope Rukmini had. This was not like Yudhisthir lying to Drona to save his soldiers - it was Krishna lying to Rukmini for no rhyme or reason Angry

Aside from that, the other bizarre thing is that Krishna is now all the time watching the Shambara channel w/ Jambavati, instead of spending his time comforting his bereaved Rukmini. I know that Satyabhama was his favorite, but watching this serial, one would think that Krishna hated Rukmini. Really, if a man and his wife had lost their first-born, wouldn't he be comforting her, instead of spending all his time watching what his baby's enemy is up to? When he himself has resolved that Ms Vidhi's vidhan will play out, and there's nothing they can or will do to change anything? Then why watch all this?

As for Pradhyumna, they've totally fictionalized Shambara. First of all, since when was Shambara afraid of the color 'red', and it's ridiculous to show him being a mamma's boy, w/ his mom upbraiding anybody who dares offend him.

Also, they've totally glossed over Pradhyumna's own divine origins. Pradhyumna wasn't raised by some anonymous fisherman & his wife. As many know, he was Kama - reborn after Shiva had incinerated Kama for disrupting his meditation. Rati, Kama's wife, had been desolate, and at one point, wanted to cremate herself, but a divine voice promised her that she'd be re-united w/ her husband, who had taken birth as Krishna's son. So Rati took the form of Mayavati and found employment in Shambara's kitchen. She was the one who the fisherman handed over the guardinship to Pradhyumna, and when Pradhyumna grew up, she fell in love w/ him. Narada narrated to her the story of Pradhyumna's origin, and what Shambara did to him, which she later narrated to Pradhyumna. After Shambara's death, she returned w/ Pradhyumna to Dwarka, and became Krishna's eldest bahu.

Anyway, SP seems to be stumbling from track to track, and has no clue of how to make this serial flow. Not to mention their ignorant rendition of Krishna's thoughts & messages. I've long lost interest in these clowns showing the Gita. The sooner Imagine TV pulls the plug on this abomination, the better.

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Posted: 03 March 2012 at 8:21pm | IP Logged

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Well Well Well So Rukmini is back and in totally human avatar I can see LOL

Rukmini is a Goddess and incarnation of Lakshami. She was a learned and a wise woman.I dont know what they are getting by showing her in this form. Trying to comit suicide and all

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Posted: 28 March 2012 at 6:32am | IP Logged

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Rukmini & Satyabhama are gone once again - it would seem that Jambavati was Krishna's chief queen.

Actually, a good track would have been showing the birth of Samba, who later among other things fought Shalva's army alongside Pradhyumna, abducted Duryodhan's daughter Lakshmanaa (Balarama had to bail him out) and finally, went cross dressed to Vishwamitra & Kanva, which caused the curse that destroyed the Yadavas.

Krishna explaining to Jambavati the esp capabilities of mothers was funny, given that Jambavati didn't seem to instill much of a sense of values in Samba.

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Posted: 28 March 2012 at 10:42am | IP Logged

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Originally posted by .Vrish.

Krishna explaining to Jambavati the esp capabilities of mothers was funny, given that Jambavati didn't seem to instill much of a sense of values in Samba.

Ddin't Krishna also have a hand in spoiling Samba, given that he was forever forgiving Samba's mistakes until his own patience ran out ?

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