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Same sex attraction. Should it be stopped? (Page 35)

..kiran.. Groupbie
..kiran..
..kiran..

Joined: 28 October 2010
Posts: 182

Posted: 02 June 2011 at 4:01pm | IP Logged
I completely disagree, on moral grounds.
 
It is a vital component of human dignity that people be afforded with agency and allowed to make their own choices on how they want to lead their lives. Who are we to tell them what is right, what is natural? 
 
Some would say that there should be limits to free choice, limits that are justified because they infringe upon other people's rights. So we can't be free to kill random people on the street. Or if we are free to do so, then we get to face the consequences of our action, our choices. The law is justified in, say, incarcerating us, thus limiting our freedom.
 
But we can never be stripped of our dignity, because it is derived from the very fact of our being human. Even as prisoners, we would have rights.
 
Anyway, point is, dignity is an unalienable right and it entails a numbe of other rights including the freedom to make our own choices. This freedom can be limited but only if it harms others.
 
Pray, tell me, how does homosexuality harm anyone?? Does it infringe upon anybody's rights?? What justifies "stopping" it?? Does it infringe upon anyone's rights? (And yes, it makes me kinda sad when the cutest guy ever turns out to be gay, but that is quite beside the point here Wink)
 
It is unacceptable that people be stripped of their right to choose their own sexual orientation. If it repulses you (and I mean "you" generally, to all homophobes out there, not the topic maker specifically) so much, just find a way to deal with it and accept it. Because it's always been there and always will be. Just because people have been, and are still often forced to hide their sexual orientation, doesn't mean it's an unnatural phenomenon that's just sprung up that you need to somehow stop. What's unnatural is treated other people like they're criminals just because they feel differently.
 
But of course you are entitled to your opinion, and you have the freedom to express it, but to actually advocate that others lead their lives according to your so-called superior standard is a pretty horrendous of using your freedom. You are trying to infringe upon other people's rights, and that should be a pretty good reason for "stopping" YOU! But let's respect your freedom (even though you can't possibly be bothered to do the same for others). Thank you for your opinion. It sucks.
 
And just as a side-note, many people don't know how much homosexuals suffer in pretending to be something they're not all their lives. It's suffocating inside that closet. I have a number of homosexual friends (it all comes from having a lesbian best friend and suddenly a significant part of your friends circle is pretty much just gays LOL), and I have heard first-hand of how they have suffered in trying to come to terms with who they are, in trying to come open with it all, in dealing with all the stigma and discrimination, the snide jokes, the attempts made at "re-educating them." It was really traumatic for my best friend when she told others about it. You can't even begin to imagine what it's like. Such a fundamental part of who you are treated with scorn and ridicule. Nobody tries to understand but they will all have an opinion.
 
And why? Seriously why should homosexuals be subjected to such an inhumane treatment? What have they done? You think it's unnatural. Cool. Yes, let me assume, to stroke your ego and for argument's sake, that you're right. It's unnatural. Forget that it's been around for centuries (apparently Shakespeare was bisexual Shocked), and yes, it's just this new crazy fad. I know that nurture is often what causes people to become gay. Let's say that that means that it's unnatural.
 
So what?
 
Why must it be stopped? Just because it makes you uncomfortable? Whatever be your grounds, religious/ scientific/ whatever?
 
You know what, grow up! The world doesn't revolve around you. Other people are human too, and they can decide to have sex in whichever way they like and kiss whoever they want. No matter how unnatural or wrong you think it is. It's not wrong as long as it harms no-one.
 
(Might I restate that I think you are wrong, because you harm many with your petty thinking, not just homosexuals directly, but also gullible souls who allow themselves to be dazzled by your so-called righteousness).
 
I haven't read through the whole thread because I got pretty much disgusted at the beginning itself, but I hope there are more that agree. Anyway, the world is a sad place.
 
 
 


Edited by ..kiran.. - 02 June 2011 at 4:13pm

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vena.cava.Rehanismreturn_to_hadesDemonStarSummer3Faraan92

..kiran.. Groupbie
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Posts: 182

Posted: 02 June 2011 at 4:08pm | IP Logged
Ok, I just read the last 2 pages. Turns out there might be hope after all. To those who still think that homosexuality should be "stopped," there's no need to subscribe to my opinion. Obviously I may be wrong myself.
 
But just try think why you think what you do. Make your own informed opinion, not based on prejudices and uneducated guesses. Try find gay people and find out their pov. Find out why homophobes think the way they do. But at the end of it all, make sense of it all for yourself.
And, if you still feel it's weird, just make sure you don't equate weird to wrong.
 
Don't just follow others blindly. It's not just stupid, it's frickin' dangerous. 
 
 


Edited by ..kiran.. - 02 June 2011 at 4:11pm

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RehanismDemonStarFaraan92

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Posted: 02 June 2011 at 4:21pm | IP Logged
@..kiran..ClapClap ClapClapThumbs Up

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..kiran..Faraan92

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Posted: 02 June 2011 at 4:33pm | IP Logged
Thank you :D
 
Wow, that was a long rant. It just makes me so, so angry because I've seen what it's like for my friend. Also I've got a thing for self-righteous peeps who believe they have a moral obligation to dictate to others what they must do.
 
I just read through your other posts in the thread. I felt really happy to see you feel pretty much the same. I loved the Dumbledore quote. I was quite shocked by how so many fans' opinion of Dumbles changed when JK Rowling said she pictured him gay. 
 
Ah, if I'd seen those posts before, I could have just quoted you and said "ditto" :P
 


Edited by ..kiran.. - 02 June 2011 at 4:34pm

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Posted: 02 June 2011 at 6:59pm | IP Logged
I think most people want their kids to be straight but if they are born otherwise they just have to accept them for what they are; just like parents wanting a child of a certain gender.

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RehanismFaraan92

-Believe- IF-Stunnerz
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Joined: 03 December 2005
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Posted: 02 June 2011 at 11:25pm | IP Logged
How many Gay memebers here...then disclose your sexuality!!? If not why? Whats sex means to these gays!!? Those who support these peoples rights...may be tomarrow some-other sexualy worried group ask for different type of rights(incest/with animal)...that time you will accept!!!?? If not why???  that time how can you tell these things are not becos of Genitical problems? then you will approve or ur education will help to solve the issue?
 
Some one mention before in religious books like Bibble/Quran/Bhagwad Geeta, the Upanishadas and the Vedas. Do you find any positive mention about homosexuality in these holy books...or even in kamasutra there is any??
Rehanism IF-Dazzler
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Posted: 03 June 2011 at 12:35am | IP Logged
@Belive---So you have resolved that you won't see any reasons, however others might try!!

Now you are suggesting that since we are defending Homos, we ourselves must be one. Grow up dude!!

I myself have never cared for religious laws as most of them are biased and has their own set of 'do's and 'dont's which are completely based on beliefs and not facts and cannot be accomodated in any progressive societies. For example, Quran says that if a girl is raped then the girl must present 4 eye witnesses to the actual 'act'. If she fails, she will be shunned as a prostitute and lashed in public. Should we follow these 'holy' laws? Quran, Bible, Shastras and Granths are all Rule-books. They can never give you true knowledge as they restrict your thinking with certain pre-defined and often prejudiced rules. They were written by men who used God's name to impose their own thoughts on others. Blindly following these laws shall lead us to stone age, as Afghanistan was going during the Taliban regime.

Bhagwat Gita, however, is NOT a Rule book. It doesn't restrict you - it sets you free. It will not tell you what to wear, how to behave, how to pray, how to eat or how to f*** or which behaviour is 'normal' & which is not. So there is no mention about these things specifically. But Bhagwat Gita encourages free broadminded thinking and stresses that men must use their own intellect, instead of prevalent traditions or customs, to decide what is right and what is wrong. It stresses on Nishkaam Karma and not any formality. Bhagwat Gita clearly says that, to Krishna you are a soul, his own inseparable part, and hence he judges you for your Karma and not your birth or existence. A true Karma Yogi is an explorer - who never fears to challenge or change the mindset of the society and that is how he attains Moksha in his mortal life.

Here's a translation from Bhagwat Gita : "Tark hi jeevan ka aadhaar hai. Yadi Vishwaas ka ankur tark ki bhoomi se nahi ugta, toh woh Andh-Vishwaas kehlata hai"

In the chapter "Prakriti aham Vikriti" Rig Veda says that anything which is in nature is natural and hence Godly. What appears unnatural to others might be another face of the same nature.

And yeah, Kamasutra openly recognizes the third sex and even shows many sexual positions exclusive to male-male or female-female sex. And mind it, Kamasutra was written in early 1st century - much before Quran or Bible or any Granth came into being.

My only advice to you is see facts and don't just go with beliefs. Ignorance is never a bliss. When the TM started the topic, he was completely against Homosexuality and believed it to be weird and abnormal and something harmful. But after seeing reasons and valid points we provided, I think, he too had agreed that things might not be as he thought. And if you are still adamant then, as Kiran said, kindly don't oppose things you don't understand (or may be, don't want to understand) or suggest inhuman treatment of Homosexuals. Hope my comments don't hurt you.



PS : Since I have pointed out flaws in Quran or Bible, that doesn't mean I am against Muslims or Chistians. The only thing I am against is blind-faith and subsequent injustice based on such faith. And belief-wise I am an Atheist - believer of one Supersoul. So religion or its principles doesn't matter to me any way.


Edited by Darklord_Rehan - 03 June 2011 at 1:13am

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Posted: 03 June 2011 at 12:45am | IP Logged
Quote:
 
Quran says that if a girl is raped then the girl must present 4 eye witnesses to the actual 'act'. If she fails, she will be shunned as a prostitute and lashed in public
 
 
Yes I did come across this, hope they change this, as in some countries the poor victims have been imprisoned instead.
 

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