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Manav : Way out of Line (Page 5)

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isomers

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isomers

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Posted: 17 December 2009 at 1:20pm | IP Logged
Originally posted by cbnerd

kools..i agree with you wholeheartedly...i dont think there is anything i can add there, you said it all. It wasn't Archana or her family's fault that Manav and his family was jailed, it was all Savita's doing. Why did he get mad that sul aai didn't want him talking to Archana when he was in jail, she was just protecting her daughter from further abuse by...again...
Savita. I think most of the views expressed on this thread which are pro Manav is only because he is HOT and he can do no wrong. Wink
 
Excuuse me! Just because we are supporting Manav doesn't mean we don't have brains. I'm in no way supporting Manav because he's hot, I'm supporting him because in my opinion he's right. What does him being hot have to do with anything at all?Confused
 
-edit add-
Does that mean you think Archana is right because she's pretty and looks innocent so she can't do anything that's wrong?Wink


Edited by nityatarlapally - 17 December 2009 at 1:25pm

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nikitagmc

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nikitagmc

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Posted: 17 December 2009 at 2:50pm | IP Logged

First of all let me tell that I'm a die hard Manav fan... many of you must be knowing this and especially koolsadhu cause I always debate with her about Manav (Its fun all the same) but today since the matter is more of a social and ethical discussion I'll try and be as unbiased as possible.

I have been reading all these arguments from both the sides... and many times thought of writing but cudn't decide which side to take, but am somewhat clear now.. have considered each point separately and will not mix the issues, I'll write it in points:

1.) The scene and the loopholes: i found the whole scene quite out of place and silly actually. It was as if the creatives wanted to focus on certain points only:
 
(1.)the basic requirement of the scene was to show Manav as an angry and ruthless man who doesn't care about Archana at all cos of what his family has suffered. That i think was achieved I suppose, call it masculinity or call it ego, it showed both aspects of his evolving character: the pain that he had suffered watching his family suffering and the fact that he doesn't really want to be the good guy for the family that has hurt him any more... by twisting her hand it was as if he deliberately wanted to show that he doesn't care for her at all, after all tht was what he had come there to declare, right??
that is what I understood of the scene..   he is ready to turn into a villain for the sake of safeguarding his family, to show them his pain even if he has to inflict pain on them he will do it... cos he doesn't really care of them anymore, he thinks what they did was wrong, so he doesn't care whether his behavior is right or wrong.. even we cannot justify his behavior, but we can only relate to his anger.
 
I must also admit that I was actually expecting a confrontation of this type, not hand wringing but Manav actually slapping Archana cos of the mixed feelings of hatred, pain and betrayal...COS THIS IS REALITY... at the end of the day we are all human... at some point our emotions control us to an extent that right/wrong doesn't really make sense... I am not saying that what he did was right, i am not even favouring him,  when they reunite, Manav shud feel terrible about how he twisted her hand that day and apologize... but i also feel that one can relate to his feelings and the emotional turmoil he went through... and yes, I do believe if he finds out Manju did it and not Archana he will definitely get wild again, for multiple reasons this time... about Savita I'm not sure... he will be so in shock that I guess he will blame himself for having trusted her...
 
Its just the same way as Sulochana hit out at Manav in the Satyanarayan Puja... I hated her for it... I want her to apologize to Manav for it one day.... but I also understand that it was a mother's anger... who was shocked on grasping the fact that her daughter had been betrayed and disgraced by her own husband... so much so that she didn't even bother to listen to his defence... It wasn't right, but understandable... no wonder Manav repeatedly went to their house to defend himself and behaved respectfully with them.
 
About what you are suggesting that if Manav is so angry, he shud take the case further up with Girishji's help or file a complaint of bad behavior in jail or something like that.. would have loved to see something like that... Manav fighting to get back the lost respect of his family... but it is difficult to expect such good ideas from creatives.. (whom to blame if not them) maybe they are not showing it this way cos it will be trouble for Manav if the case goes up cos Savita's behavior is seriously punishment worthy
 
(2.) Indirectly point to the fact that he is still ignorant about the many terrors unleashed by his mother on Archana 
Its true: Manav was never physically present at any of the occasions when Archana was insulted, and for a large part was never told, even when he came to know then he only came to know at the most that she was rude to her (like at Satish's office-he went and apologised for it), I doubt he ever came to know how badly she character assasinated her, except at Sachin's function that was in front of his family and more so to his baba , there his baba slapped her and the matter ended, once more when Aai had spoken of her in bad language was in front of Manav only and at that time he had given her a blasting of a lifetime.
Manav doesn't even know that Savita had taken dowry... he probably thinks the matter was settled out.. first with him buying jewellery and then with he and his kaka together blasting savita together,saying they dont' want the gold... bcos when the next day vinod and manju brought the necklace they bought the pendant as well... but savita said in one of the episodes that she is hiding the truth of sachin's pendant cos she is scared of manav... so you see Manav doesn't know about the jewellery business at all... plus he had returned back all the jewellery   (its all about Misunderstandings.. the name of this serial should be misunderstanding)
 
The way the story has been moving I am quite sure Manav doesn't even know the extent to which Savita terrorised and mentally harassed Archana, he doesn't know she got the divorce papers and the ways in which she harassed Archana to get them signed, the managalsutra business...nothing...
 
Its not difficult to understand why the creatives are showing Manav as unaware- if he comes to know then half of the misunderstandings will be clear (which obviously creatives don't want) he will take Archana's side, maybe break relations with his mom, and earn the Karanjkar family's respect again.
That also explains why Vinod and his family didn't speak up, or nobody took Manju's name.
 
But overall the scene left me disappointed, for the first time Manav's dialogues were all wrong....
1.)"the complaint was for physical and mental torture... have I ever even raised my voice at you.."
one of them cud have easily cut out this one statement with a simple line..."oh yeah sure.. you go about sleeping with whores and trap my sister and disgrace her.. and then you say you haven't tortured her..."
 
2.) Showing his Aai's bruises was the second mistake... he shud have brought Vandu if he really wanted them to realise what they did wrong... it was not good defence at all, they could have really dropped the bomb on him revealing everything about his Aai and how many bruises Archana has suffered...
 
3.)  Most of the stress was on the physical damage, that is on the beatings... that was poor defence, he knows the family hates him... why would they feel sorry for him.. it was his job to make them realize exactly where they were wrong...I was expecting some lines like below...
 
"I know what you people think of me... I know that my Aai too has not really been very good to you... but what did Kaka, Vandu, Baba, and Sachin do to deserve this punishment... they have treated you so well always.. I would not have said anything if you wanted to punish me, I wud have understood it even if it was against my Aai, but why punish the rest of them.. when one person hurt you, 5 people always stood up for you.. why did you defy their trust today..?"
Am sure no one would have  had any answer to this question... it clearly justifies his anger and doesn't even make him look bad for defending Aai
 
"Archana tell me... when you were in that house... did I not stand up for you always.. protect you from everyone.. go against even my Aai for you... you talk of physical harassment... have i ever raised my voice at you, leave alone raising a hand... have I ever crossed my limits... you talk of mental harassment.. did I not push you into telling me everytime if you had any problem with my Aai or anyone else... when my Aai asked for dowry, did not I and my kaka stand up for you and say we didn't need the gold.. didn't we return every bit of your jewellery when you left home even before your asking for them...if you were angry with my Aai why didn't you bring it up then, why did you ask me not to apologise for my Aai's behavior saying she's your mother.... why did you make me promise to keep out of your fights with her...I don't say we are very good people.. but the truth is that when one person hurt you... 5 people stood up for you.. if you were so harassed in that house... cudn't you have even told us so... wud we have not come to help you... why were you even living in that house if you were so harassed..."
Would have loved to see this scene and Archana's reaction to these lines..
 
3.) My favourite part:
"That one month in that house was harassment for you wasn't it... good that the truth came out about what you think about that period.. it was the most beautiful time of my life.. I thought even if we get separated I would be happy living the rest of my life with those memories, but today those are my nightmares... everytime I remember it I feel sick... am left searching for my mistakes.. what... what exactly did I do wrong that Archana complained... especially when she had earlier confessed to me that she couldn't have been happier... "
 
4.) Today that one month is harassment for you.. you have clearly forgotten how you once told me that you couldn't have been happier elsewhere... you have forgotten everything.. but this time you made a big mistake ... you forgot that I am the same Manav Deshmukh that I was 15 yrs ago, when I left my studies, my dreams, my future, EVERYTHING only so that my family could be happy... today you have stumbled upon my weak point- my family... uptil now you have hurt me numerous times, but I suffered in silence... you threw me out like dirt from your life.. and all I did was to cry... but today I WILL NOT CRY... I WILL NOT CRY FOR A WOMAN LIKE YOU ANYMORE WHO IS NOTHING MORE THAN MY LIFE'S BIGGEST MISTAKE... for what you have done to my family, I will never forgive you or your family... NEVER EVER!!!!!!!!!!
 
These dialogues could have done justice to everything.. his pain.. his anger.. his family's sufferings and best was he would not have ended up looking like the devil's advocate (that is actually Savita's advocate)
even if the Karanjkar family are angry with Savita (and rightfully so) they wud have felt sorry for the rest of his family and the fact that Manav is not responsible for his Aai's deeds.. also that he doesn't really know about the tortures Savita Aai has done on Archu..

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koolsadhu1000unknown18

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IF-Stunnerz

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Posted: 17 December 2009 at 3:21pm | IP Logged
That was incredible Clap Clap Clap
Why can't the creatives think of something like that those lines would've been perfect for the scene and would've made more sense too as they are romantic and to the point
Also agree with you on the part about supporting him because he's good looking I actually like ankita more than sushant (really little bit) but still like manav's character more than archus.
But agree those lines would've made more sense and the slap part don't know but I think in the coming episodes it's definetely coming probably when sachim dies and if does blame her for it then archu will be right but now manav is

-JC-

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Posted: 17 December 2009 at 4:46pm | IP Logged
Nice post and i do agree with the initial post. Sorry didn't get time to read thru every reply.. but i am sure there are staunch supporters of Manav who justify the actions because he has the right to be angry for what happened to him and his family. Still Manav is not the kind of guy who believes that two wrongs make one right. He knows better and was shown to be more sensible than that. However, it is understandable that under the conditions where the people you love most (and not just Savita but entire family of Manav including the people who loved Archu genuinely) were tortured unfairly and to cruel extent on behalf of Archana (doesn't matter that she herself is not the reason for it)... finally Manav's wall of patience has worn thin and the goody goody nature has gone flying because he is just been pushed to the limit. So he becomes cruel himself in an effort to maintain some sort of balance in his life. Its not right... ofcourse not and Manav doesn't get off doing this to Archu but this behavior is definitely not surprising from any other human who is not expected to be a mahatma.

So finally the crack in Manav's character comes in this form that when pushed to the absolute limits he retaliates too...even so against the wrong person and in a wrong way but he reacts. Anger does cloud one's judgement and so it is with Manav. Not a justification for his actions and we'll see him repent for his actions i am sure.  Just like Archana is not perfect and doubted his character and believed him to be the low life that the pimp blamed him to be... and in her own words.. followed what her family expected from her instead of standing by her husband because her heart told her to believe in him... she too repents for that. Same way Manav too will repent for his mistakes.

As for Manav's love for Savita.. I think we are forgetting how much Savita's atrocities against Archana, Manav is actually aware of. Remember there is a lot still unspoken between Manav and Archana which are the cause of every misunderstanding between them. Whatever that maybe... as far as i know.. Savita herself will be the cause to break Manav's illusions about his "loving" mother.  So i'd say lets wait and watch and not be disheartened cuz as far as i see PR is still very hatke from the current lot of serials, in terms of expressing the intricacies of relationships (and every relationship.. not just between husband wife but between parents and children, siblings, and in-laws of all kinds)

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devashree_hkoolsadhu1000nikitagmc

loveabletwinz

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Posted: 17 December 2009 at 6:17pm | IP Logged

@ everyone who posted on this thread - great posts! you all make excellent points ;)

 
@nikitagmc - incredible post! loveddd the dialogues! *SIGH* ive said this, if only we, members, were on the creative team, this show would go so many places! haha!
 
@koolsadhu1000 - like nikitagmc, i couldnt decide where i stood on this.. but finally, i think i actually agree with you...well, atleast somewhat! lol! The reason that track is running so well, is because we see the angry young man in manav. we like to see how hatred becomes love, its balaji's tried and used formula! it alwasy works...but anyway.. back onto topic.. the thing is, we're all forgetting to see both sides of the coin! i agree, manav should not have gotten physical...yes, he was angry and hurt, but there are less aggressive ways to address the issue... more polite ways! words are just as enough to prove your point! there is no need to resolve to violence. But i also agree with everyone when they say that he was trying to prove a point to the Karanjikar family. Also, when Manav did twist her arm, he did say bas pal bhar ke liye chua.. so i dont think the physical impact was as much as we thought it was. when you slow down a scene that much, it looks worse than it is. about whether manav would twist manjusha's arm or not, well...you answered your own question :) he has no "right" over manjusha, so he wouldnt! and he would not raise a hand on his mother, because we all agree, it is a sin! And about hurting archana like that... i just have to say that even if he doesnt consider her his wife anymore, usee uska aurat hona ka tho lihaaz karna chahiye tha! but if you look at it from his point of view, like vandu's case - she had no fault in this. Neither did sachin, or kaka, or even damodar! the only person at fault was savita - and she got what she deserved! i dont think there is a right or wrong to this - everyone reacts differently. Fact is, men do raise their hand on their wives - no, it does not make it correct...but lets just look at how physical manav got with archana.
 
yikes - BRB!
 
*EDITED*
 
had to run for a moment! *blush*
 
ayayayii! i just forgot my point! *SIGH* i'll be back when i remember :( (if i do that is) meanwhile, keep this discussion rolling! loving it!
 


Edited by loveabletwinz - 17 December 2009 at 6:20pm

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koolsadhu1000

koolsadhu1000

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Posted: 17 December 2009 at 6:53pm | IP Logged
Originally posted by loveabletwinz

@ everyone who posted on this thread - great posts! you all make excellent points ;)

 
@nikitagmc - incredible post! loveddd the dialogues! *SIGH* ive said this, if only we, members, were on the creative team, this show would go so many places! haha!
 
@koolsadhu1000 - like nikitagmc, i couldnt decide where i stood on this.. but finally, i think i actually agree with you...well, atleast somewhat! lol! The reason that track is running so well, is because we see the angry young man in manav. we like to see how hatred becomes love, its balaji's tried and used formula! it alwasy works...but anyway.. back onto topic.. the thing is, we're all forgetting to see both sides of the coin! i agree, manav should not have gotten physical...yes, he was angry and hurt, but there are less aggressive ways to address the issue... more polite ways! words are just as enough to prove your point! there is no need to resolve to violence. But i also agree with everyone when they say that he was trying to prove a point to the Karanjikar family. Also, when Manav did twist her arm, he did say bas pal bhar ke liye chua.. so i dont think the physical impact was as much as we thought it was. when you slow down a scene that much, it looks worse than it is. about whether manav would twist manjusha's arm or not, well...you answered your own question :) he has no "right" over manjusha, so he wouldnt! and he would not raise a hand on his mother, because we all agree, it is a sin! And about hurting archana like that... i just have to say that even if he doesnt consider her his wife anymore, usee uska aurat hona ka tho lihaaz karna chahiye tha! but if you look at it from his point of view, like vandu's case - she had no fault in this. Neither did sachin, or kaka, or even damodar! the only person at fault was savita - and she got what she deserved! i dont think there is a right or wrong to this - everyone reacts differently. Fact is, men do raise their hand on their wives - no, it does not make it correct...but lets just look at how physical manav got with archana.
 
yikes - BRB!
 
*EDITED*
 
had to run for a moment! *blush*
 
ayayayii! i just forgot my point! *SIGH* i'll be back when i remember :( (if i do that is) meanwhile, keep this discussion rolling! loving it!
 
 
LOLLOLloveabletwinz..........ur post is as lovable as ur id . LOL

Tanyaz

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Posted: 17 December 2009 at 6:55pm | IP Logged
Excellent debate , . I loved every post and all of you have valid points . I agree with all of you , somehow  you all seems right  .
You guys should be writing scripts and dialogues ......you all are too good .
 
I feel bad for both Archana and Manav . Just don't like Salochna and totally hate savita  and manjusha.


Edited by Tanyaz - 17 December 2009 at 6:55pm

koolsadhu1000

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Posted: 17 December 2009 at 7:05pm | IP Logged
Originally posted by Tanyaz

Excellent debate , . I loved every post and all of you have valid points . I agree with all of you , somehow  you all seems right  .
You guys should be writing scripts and dialogues ......you all are too good .
 
I feel bad for both Archana and Manav . Just don't like Salochna and totally hate savita  and manjusha.
 
Tanyaz u wont believe it but ur gonna live for a hundred years . I was just thinking of u as i skimmed thru the replies and wondering how come Tanyaz hasnt jumped in the discussion . And  just then u replied .Smile

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